SRT Revolution - Why Now?

[SouthSoundTree]

Bonner,

Crossloading a biner is possibility at a place you can't inspect before relying on it. A large eye splice or running bowline would be safer.

 

[PCTREE]

I know cross loading a binner is bad but with what a 100lbs load do you really think that is an issue??

 

[PCTREE]

I know cross loading a binner is bad but with what a 100lbs load do you really think that is an issue??

Bonner I still haven't tried any form of Srt other than ascent but it is on my list for 2012....

 

[SouthSoundTree]

I know cross loading a binner is bad but with what a 100lbs load do you really think that is an issue??

I'm closer to 200 pounds, and there is the leverage factor. Its probably ok.

I imagine the spine is much, much tougher than the gate. Regardless, with life support, I'd climb much more effectively, and without distraction with a RB or Splice-girth-hitched. Distraction could lead to other errors.

 

[PCTREE]

I realize most climbers are more than 100 but after the rope has gone around the branch Im surer the biner "sees" much less, maybe not half but I would still figure it to be insignificant with regards to the biner ....

 

[bonner1040]

I imagine that crossloading it is a factor to consider; although in my experience using a pear shaped biner, being pulled up, it is pretty unlikely to crossload. Once it begins its travel with the narrow side facing up it would take a significant jostle to turn it around and then some bad luck to maintain that orientation.

Since we don't work in a place with the luxury of relying on "luck" and what is "most likely"; a captive eye carabiner or even a large mallion/quicklink solves that concern rather easily though with little additional cost or hassle. Also both serve as convenient attachment points for a retrieval line.

I believe using a biner makes it much easier to retrieve, especially on something with heavy bark like a silver maple, a large diameter TIP or anything similar that could generate significant friction. Once you begin pulling it down it really makes a difference.

Definitely not the only solution, just another tool in the toolbox.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

I see where you figure the 100 pounds. I didn't before. Makes sense.

I wasn't figuring crossloading on the rope, rather levering over an edge (flat biner, round trunk).

I'm still better with a RB.

The mallion-rapide, being smaller, would have less theoretical leverage over an edge. A good idea.

More than one way to skin a cat.

 

[bonner1040]

You obviously dont know what you are talking about. There is only ONE way to skin a cat my friend. ONLY ONE!

A running bowline works fine I am sure.

 

[NeTree]

And then the logger comes along while all of you are frigging with your gear and arguing technique, and cuts the sumbeyotch at the stump perfectly to a tight lay.

 

[Reddog]

Yea, but it was only suppose to be a tip reduction, now it is a basal prune

 

[NeTree]

And how much easier are the tips to reach NOW, huh?

 

[top_notch]

Exactly, just put a couple of door hinges on the stump and but of the tree, stand it back up, add a little hot glue and scotch tape and it'll heal right up.

 

[flushcut]

Exactly, just put a couple of door hinges on the stump and but of the tree, stand it back up, add a little hot glue and scotch tape and it'll heal right up.

Oh no, you should be using the self-bonding electrical tape made by 3M it is much better for the cambium and hot glue is so last decade.

 

[Jack]

Oh no, you should be using the self-bonding electrical tape made by 3M it is much better for the cambium and hot glue is so last decade.

As Seen On TV

 

[CurSedVoyce]

I was thinkin more like this stuff....

 

[NeTree]

 

[chris_girard]

I like seeing the different responses to this thread. Very interesting. I still can't say one way or another on the RW until I have tried it, but I have a feeling that I will be a convert, based on the experience that I've already had with SRT.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

I can say this... The F8 Revolver set up made the SRT nice for working canopy. Still not as smooth as Ddrt. You have to fuss with the system to make sure the 8 is where it need be. I have not tried the RW as yet and I do plan on buying one to play with. Again, I doubt there will be less tending than with a Ddrt. The wrench will always have to be worked and set up on the rope so it engages proper or your hitch will bind. IMO. Like I said I have not tried it as yet.
I always feel it a fallacy to think a hitch set up is completely self minding. I always make sure my hitch is set when I am moving about a tree. So some tending no matter what system is always in order.
And I will say it for the umpteenth time... Right tool for the job at hand. One tool is not a perfect solution. And that is not only job dependent, but climber dependent as well.

Is SRT having a revolution? I see it more as having some new innovation that is really cool.
BTW.. I just bought one of those stiff steps from On Rope for my SRT set up.

 

[tophopper]

SRT is nothing new to our industry, and is not the future of tree climbing IMO.

 

[sotc]

I imagine that crossloading it is a factor to consider; although in my experience using a pear shaped biner, being pulled up, it is pretty unlikely to crossload. Once it begins its travel with the narrow side facing up it would take a significant jostle to turn it around and then some bad luck to maintain that orientation.

Since we don't work in a place with the luxury of relying on "luck" and what is "most likely"; a captive eye carabiner or even a large mallion/quicklink solves that concern rather easily though with little additional cost or hassle. Also both serve as convenient attachment points for a retrieval line.

I believe using a biner makes it much easier to retrieve, especially on something with heavy bark like a silver maple, a large diameter TIP or anything similar that could generate significant friction. Once you begin pulling it down it really makes a difference.

Definitely not the only solution, just another tool in the toolbox.

This has been a fun thread to read.
This looks like a good place to slap a hitch climber in the mix.
My new years resolution is to get this RW paper weight off my desk and try the lousy thing out

 

[DMc]

It's new ways to do our work more efficiently. If I were young and still climbing I'd make the switch too. Good stuff. I see many benefits to it.

The way it is. Plain and simple.

Simple words from a man that understands the world of tree work.

Chris, as has been stated, SRT has been around for a long time, what has changed is the development of simple tools that allow the ability to change from ascent to work positioning with no change over. I do wish the sales pitch and hype would mellow out. This new way of working trees is no more dangerous than DdRT, but certainly no less. Working a tree is not just tree climbing or rope climbing but a combination of both and is made far more dangerous by the tasks we are asked to accomplish. A lack of understanding or a careless movement can have serious and sometimes permanent consequences. That is a truth regardless of the tools or technique you use.

SRT will not make anyone a better climber any more than using a popular saddle or saw will. It does, however, offer many things beyond what is achievable in doubled rope technique. I climbed on DdRT for most of my career, which just so happens to be longer than some of you have been alive, and know what it can and cannot do. I now use SRT on every tree, large or small.

Dave

 

[Old Monkey]

SRT Revolution, sounds like a good name for Petzl's next saddle.

 

[rangerdanger]

I can say this... The F8 Revolver set up made the SRT nice for working canopy. Still not as smooth as Ddrt. You have to fuss with the system to make sure the 8 is where it need be. I have not tried the RW as yet and I do plan on buying one to play with. Again, I doubt there will be less tending than with a Ddrt. The wrench will always have to be worked and set up on the rope so it engages proper or your hitch will bind. IMO. Like I said I have not tried it as yet.
I always feel it a fallacy to think a hitch set up is completely self minding. I always make sure my hitch is set when I am moving about a tree. So some tending no matter what system is always in order.

Just an FYI, I'm guessing with the F8 you rock a long tether between the hitch and 8, with the RW you want just the opposite, a very short tether. In my experience, the hitch hardly ever binds, because, as long as you have the correct tether length, the RW will usually be engaged to one degree or another, enough so that the hitch doesn't bind.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

The F8 Revolver set up does not tend as well as the RW so you have to fuss with it no matter your tether. My tether is about the same length as what is recommended for the RW. I have had a longer tether on it, and it behaves the same, you just have to reach out further to tend the 8 out away from the hitch to make the hitch function properly. Shorter tether or not... to make the hitch behave proper and not be bound up in case of an emergency and you need to bail.... the wrench would also have to be tended out away from the hitch to perform as necessary... Under normal conditions of moving about the canopy, chances are it is not a problem to loosen the hitch and tend the RW a tad to let line out in a limb walk or planned rappel. Best be ready to rock if something ill happens however. And you will still need the RW to add friction NOW. JMO. After I try it out, that opinion may change.
You can not beat how an SRT system redirects and it's ascent efficiency (short for some of the footlockers in our crowd). But as far as less tending for taking line in and out of a system, Ddrt is a hard to beat set up. IMHO..
Mind you I am rather new at rope work compared to some here... I am sure Burnam or Gerry will correct me soon enough if I am out in left field with this.

 

[Ax-Man]

I shouldn't really be replying to this because of my limited experience with SRT but I just didn't really feel comfortable with it. Nothing felt right with all my weight on the hitch. I wasn't too keen on just being on one rope tied to the base of the tree. That same rope would catch limbs, guide them down to the base of the tree. Getting the system set-up was time consuming to me. Using mechanical acenders with backups frustrated me. I just shucked the whole system.

Sorry for being so negative. I guess I am just a little too old fashion for the newer methods. I can see where it appeals to the younger guys.

I have not tried it but Gerry's method of using two foot acsenders on a single line looks the slickest and easiest method to me for a long hike into a big tall tree if you don't want to hoof it by doing the old fashioned footlocking or doing the single line footlock thing.