Tree felling vids

[Burnham]

If a sawyer fells several dozen trees a day, if they are worth anything in the talent department, they will soon get to where it is seldom that their cuts don't match up...if they give a fig about doing so. And any sawyer worth the name does care about accurate felling cuts.

The rest of us just have to correct things occasionally. The more important thing is knowing that the face needs to be done right (and what "right" means), and fixing a miss before proceeding.

I fear Stig would have a stroke if he had to watch me cut for long ...I'm not perfect out of the gate every single time, that's for sure. I'm good, but perfection is beyond me, as my work has me felling the number of hazard trees in a year that Stig, or any full time logger, does in a few days or weeks.

That little bit of cleaning up the face that started the fracus seems to be awfully minor to be critical of, to me...not enough to call into question the skills of the cutter.

But that's my opinion, and Stig has the chops, in spades, to have every right to his position, too.

I do know with certainty that looking down on his abilities is quite obviously ignorant, and doing so does not impress this old man.

 

[Tucker943]

I mismatch cuts. Not often, but sometimes, and never by much. It depends how much I care. If I'm whacking a tree and the lay is wide open, lumber value is no issue, and the tree favors the lay, then I dont care if I'm slightly mismatched. Not one bit. It makes absolutely no difference at all. When falling trees for saw logs, or trees that count, my cuts match perfect the first time, typically.

 

[FJR]

Now can someone tell Stig to get on back here, it isn't the same without'em.

 

[Jed]

Good to have you back B.

We res. arbos really consider it bragging rights when the diagonal comes out right on the spot. Of course none of us can do it very well cause we usually have a pole-pruner or hedge-trimmers in our hands.

I'll cheat a lot cause the boys won't know what I'm up to. By "cheat" I mean: 1) Clean out the undercut with saw-pulses super, super good. 2) Sight through the undercut with my right eye. (Left eye closed) 3) Hold the bar of the saw up to the undercut (Humboldt or Regular don't matter) while "sighting" through the undercut, AND ALONG THE PLANE OF THE BAR AT THE SAME TIME. 4) Visually match all four points of the plane up. Point one: the top of the bar. Point two: the bottom of the bar. Point three: The near corner of the undercut. Point four: the far corner. 5) Pulse the saw up and cut in before dogging in.

Works like a champ for the diagonal AND the back-cut, however, one becomes a terrible nerd whilst cutting this way, and I'd really rather not be a nerd. Plus it don't work when the bar don't reach all the way through. What Would Stig Do? So again, I ask you: anybody got any advice on how I can make my cuts match up without getting tons of sawdust in my eyes?

I mention all this cause I'm usually only doing it whilst on spurs and flipline. However, I notice that when I end up falling an entire Fir to a crucial lay, I end up reverting to my nerdy methodology to get my stupid cuts to line up; and this means that I end up lying on by back or my belly, in wet duff, like an idiot, while any run-of-the-mill widow-maker could put an end to my priceless treehouse posts. Still.... Doug Dent wld roll over in his grave.

 

[gf beranek]

In wide open lays a mismatch in the felling cut does not always present issues. In which case we can often get by with less than perfection, but in those thread the needle shots to lay a tree in a mismatch cut can most certainly can become an issue. Which makes correcting even the most minor very well worth the time and effort.

I'm my own worst critic when it comes to missing a lay. But accuracy in tree felling goes beyond the simplicity of just matching our cuts up perfectly. It rests a lot on reading the tree and understanding the dynamics of each situation too.

 

[Tucker943]

Well said.

 

[Al Smith]

Rambling on there's tricks to everything .I've had pics on here of my cuts and they usually match pretty good which is not to say if I or anyone else missed by an RCH they won't work .Much ado over little of nothing .

If you miss the lay by 2 foot most times it matters little .If you kick it 90 degrees off that is a big deal .

Samo with the cut .Sure it's cool beans I suppose to cut the damned thing right at ground level root flair and all --if you're a veneer cutter .Most including myself take them off 18" or so up at a comforable level then stump it out .It really isn't that big of a deal IMO .Might be in other places and that I know not of .

 

[SkwerI]

Blows my mind seeing residential tree guys trying to cut trees at ground level, notching through the root flare, only to buck up the trunk after it's on the ground.

 

[murphy4trees]

Nice and smooth operator, for sure.
And the dog melted my heart.
Around here, having to recut your face like that would detract from the points given, though.
A real good faller is expected to match his cuts first time.

he put the tree on the ground in 2:15 seconds, which is shows great skill imo... with a big tree,
maybe 40-45" at the cut, an 1.5x the bar length, suggesting that he is not a "real good" faller because "he didn't match his face cuts" is a slap in the face of excellence.. stig might downplay the comment, but its way out of line imo... the faller did perfectly match his face cuts like he was tying his shoes, and only had to spend 25 seconds cleaning out the face from he little bits left when he moved the saw. that's not mismatching cuts... total bs stig...

that dog was cool.. gotta love the fallers personality. awesome video... just leave it at that....

you've made similar criticisms about my falling cuts (which are no where near as polished)... criticizing a suburban arb for lacking the speed and precision in cutting as a pro faller is total crap as well...

 

[Tucker943]

Let's move on.

 

[murphy4trees]

what do you want to talk about????

how bout this..

<iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/PcVweNjv-aw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

i got a little sloppy on the first face (as stig would be the first to point out (if he was still around), you can see the difference from one side to the other in the corners... the the tree moves maybe 15-20 degrees, and seizes... there's a skid loader on that pull line... i always love those little surprises, and try to learn from every one.. seems like the right side of that face must have seized.. i wonder if that could be made done reliably and turned to the fallers advantage in a specific situation...

 

[Marc-Antoine]

There is an advantage to cut low in the backyards : the butt hits the ground smoothly and doesn't make a divot like falling from 20" or more. And it's easier to buck the trunk as his low side is still just on the ground level and not in a trench.
Though it's easy to correct that by putting some other logs in the lay, just near the stump.

 

[pantheraba]

Looked like nice, clean efficient fells to me...I DO like that fast speed high pitched termite sound with the fast action...good effect.

On two of the trees you cut out a thin sliver from the base of the face cut. It looked OK to me before you cut out the sliver. What did you see that I don't?

 

[sotc]

Little dutchmen dancing around in the face cut

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Yup, what Willy said.

 

[Metals406]

Little dutchmen dancing around in the face cut

Yup, a saw kerf will break your hinge lickety split! I always check my face for dutchmen's -- well, the ones that aren't supposed to be there anyway.

 

[Jed]

Daniel wrenches on his bars pretty good. I wonder if they ever get tweaked. Not to start in with mere regionally snobbery for the nine-millionth time, but I've just gotta wonder if it wouldn't be easier on the saw and the operator if he knocked out a gap with an axe instead of those mega-wide diagonals.

Can't quarrel with his aim though... dead on. Good drops Murph. Thanks so much for posting the flick.

 

[murphy4trees]

Looked like nice, clean efficient fells to me...I DO like that fast speed high pitched termite sound with the fast action...good effect.

On two of the trees you cut out a thin sliver from the base of the face cut. It looked OK to me before you cut out the sliver. What did you see that I don't?

those two were OK.. read the intro an discussion on youtube for more details..

 

[Marc-Antoine]

So no unwanted dutchman here, but adding a tiny gap at the bottom of the face cut

 

[murphy4trees]

exactly...

 

[stig]

you've made similar criticisms about my falling cuts (which are no where near as polished)... criticizing a suburban arb for lacking the speed and precision in cutting as a pro faller is total crap as well...

I never did that, Daniel.

I criticized a guy who makes " how to do" videos for not being able to make a face in two cuts.
Big difference IMO.

When I make instruction videos, I make sure every detail is in order, or do it over till I get it right.

Besides, busting your chops about your saw skills seems to have worked.
Your latest videos show a marked improvement

 

[murphy4trees]

I criticized a guy who makes " how to do" videos for not being able to make a face in two cuts.
Big difference IMO.

I don't try to make the cut perfect in two cuts, unless its easy... I purposely make the second cut a little high, so the tip of the bar is visible on the matching cut ( third cut).. takes an extra 20 seconds on average.. BUT really its faster depending on how you look at it.. I see arbs trying to match the face in two cuts, stop and go back to the truck to get the ax and beat the face loose, or pull the bar and re-cut the first cut and then the second etc... That is what I teach and its very practical for suburban arbs..

 

[Tucker943]

Making a face cut is universal, arborist or logger. There's no difference. I'm not seeing where suburban arb comes into play. A face cut is a face cut, in the woods, or in the city.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

I don't try to make the cut perfect in two cuts, unless its easy... I purposely make the second cut a little high, so the tip of the bar is visible on the matching cut ( third cut).. takes an extra 20 seconds on average.. BUT really its faster depending on how you look at it.. I see arbs trying to match the face in two cuts, stop and go back to the truck to get the ax and beat the face loose, or pull the bar and re-cut the first cut and then the second etc... That is what I teach and its very practical for suburban arbs..

Why did he have to go back to the truck for it ?
Leave it with his wedges as well?

 

[murphy4trees]

Making a face cut is universal, arborist or logger. There's no difference. I'm not seeing where suburban arb comes into play. A face cut is a face cut, in the woods, or in the city.

It has to do with repetition.. When cutting dozens or even a hundred face cuts a day, day after day, honing the skill to shave seconds becomes crucial for productivity... a suburban arb is better off spending a few extra seconds to ensure a clean face, when its done only a few times a day on average.. taking the extra seconds to ensure a perfect face, is well worth it, when there is a 3 million dollar house at risk.. very practical...