Ya'll be careful! (no gore)

[winch]

Hey MB, was there a pretty significant shockload to the crane when that face closed? Or did it close at all?

I understand there is a bit of wiggle room in every rule, and I wasn't saying it shouldn't be done (face for crane picks), more that sometimes unexperienced sawyers sometimes go to rote memorization rather than brain use. In other words, you have to understand WHY you are using a face notch. I think I get why you did, but that had to shock the crane a bit - no?

 

[SkwerI]

I would guess that the crane operator kept the butt on the ground until after the load tipped and settled. Snatching the load up off the ground would have shock loaded the crane but the cut was made at ground level.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Roger that, and there were two tag lines with four men. The ball was only a couple, three feet from being over the load, perfectly. When the face closed, that put the ball in the proper positing. Then I finished the cut.

It's not something I do every day and I usually don't make a pie cut.

 

[woodworkingboy]

I find narrow face cuts useful on a crane pick when it's a long reach topping, and there is limb weight that gives twist. Open it up a bit on two or three sides like sharpening a pencil, then cut it off. It saves having the crane from needing to compensate for the pick moving so the bar doesn't get stuck, or makes it easier to straighten the pick from ANY direction it might move to, with the gap in there. Also at the stump when its a very long reach and picking up the weight is prohibitive, so the pick gets leaned towards the crane and dropped off the stump, then bounced in to where it can get picked up. Sloping cut on the bottom. We've got it worked out and it's fun to do that, tree goes bouncy bouncy.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Stand it up!

<aju>

 

[woodworkingboy]

It takes shoulder and forearm strength to one hand up like that.

 

[MasterBlaster]

I am strong like bull. Actually, you can't see but I made most of the cut in a good position and was using two hands.

 

[SkwerI]

I am strong like bull.

And smart like ox.

 

[squisher]

My new guy is not that experienced with a saw, had him cut a few pieces up today. He was 'revving' the saw against the chainbrake to warm it up. But I've told him once we'll see if it happens again.

 

[SkwerI]

A buddy of mine (who has been doing treework for 30 years) likes to fire up the saw and set it down to idle for 5 minutes before using it. People make up the weirdest ways to screw up saws, don't they?

 

[woodworkingboy]

A friend with chainsaw experience came over and I made the mistake of handing him a saw I just modified. He jammed the thing up to max rpms and held it there for like thirty seconds. I was kind of going out of my skin.

 

[squisher]

This guy is totally into learning my ways though, really open to that. So I have hope.

 

[woodworkingboy]

That seems easy enough to get a handle on and doesn't require practice. He should learn it quick.

 

[squisher]

Yah, it's all the rest of the intricacies that go/come with being a proficient cutter that I'm worried about. As of right now, he only will cut while being supervised/instructed.

 

[MasterBlaster]

This guy is totally into learning my ways though, really open to that.

And it doesn't get any better than that, brudder.

 

[squisher]

Yah, I lucked out I think. This guy seems to have a genuine interest in the work. I won't really know until a few weeks have passed though, some guys start out with a bang. But I'm betting this guy works out great.

 

[MasterBlaster]

If he likes it that much, then he'll be leaving you as soon as you train him.

But! Maybe not!

 

[squisher]

And like I've said in another thread I wouldn't blame him. If he's got the skillz, I'll pay him well. If he finds better money, good for him.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

Hope he heals well, and quickly.

A buddy of mine (who has been doing treework for 30 years) likes to fire up the saw and set it down to idle for 5 minutes before using it. People make up the weirdest ways to screw up saws, don't they?

By fire up the saw, do you simply mean start it? Then is there something wrong with letting the saw warm up for that long, or is it something else that I didn't understand?

I get surprised when I see people start saws, then immediately run them WOT. Seems like starting a vehicle and then immediately running it up to 5000 RPMS.

I try to explain saws like cars. The chain brake if for emergencies, like the parking brake. If you need to use it at any time for safety,fine, otherwise, you park the car before engaging.

If I'm doing a removal or cutting wood, my instinct now is to put the chain to wood to stop the chain.

I think that the throttle interlock is ignored and the chain brake used the way the TI is meant to be used. If you are going to walk around, hold the saw by the front handle/ release the TI and trigger. Same with a climbing saw.

A way that I reduce one-handing (especially if I have to cut things on the right side of the trunk, where holding with one hand would mean holding with left and catching with right), is to run the chain to a stop against the trunk while the limb is falling, after a snap cut. With the chain stopped, saw held on front handle with left hand, right hand off of the TI/ throttle trigger, I can grab the falling limb and steer it or hold it. (not that this is groundbreaking or anything)

Sometimes, I catch myself putting on the chainbrake when it is totally unnecessary (left hand on front handle, no right hand on saw) and about to take few steps on level, clear ground. When bucking a log into firewood, I'll often put the bar tip on the log as I shift over 1-2 feet rather than the CB, or again, hand off the throttle/ TI.

Before I put a saw down on the ground or hang on harness (mostly, sometimes not, but its shut off), I put on the brake. Before starting I put on the brake (I was taught this way, I immediately hit the trigger once it starts running on half-choke, so as to drop it to Run). I never was excited about the spinning chain at half-choke, maybe because I drop start a lot of saws a lot of the time.

 

[winch]

By fire up the saw, do you simply mean start it? Then is there something wrong with letting the saw warm up for that long, or is it something else that I didn't understand?

I think he means the guy starts the saw and never gets it out of it's "high idle" position, and the chain brake is still engaged. That will mess up a saw. If you want to warm it up for five minutes, you have to bump the throttle after starting so the chain isn't trying to turn against the chain brake.

I totally agree with the throttle interlock idea, too, southsound. I often times will do what you say (stop chain on wood, go lefty with saw) without engaging the brake. Trying to imagine tripping and something pinching the TI and trigger at the same time seems pretty tricky. Of course, it could happen, so if there are obstacles or terrain to deal with, chain brake it is - it's not that hard to engage.

 

[vharrison]

He's gonna feel it for the rest of his life, for sure. It's good things weren't worse.

Let's be careful out there, people!

Gosh, you think so? I sure hope not. Doc said he would recover fine.

 

[Al Smith]

A buddy of mine (who has been doing treework for 30 years) likes to fire up the saw and set it down to idle for 5 minutes before using it. People make up the weirdest ways to screw up saws, don't they?

They did that with those old reed valve Macs and Homies back in the day .They didn't warm up to operating temps as quickly a more modern saw .

A modern saw if tuned properly hits oparating temp in about 1 cut .

 

[SouthSoundTree]

I always have to grit my teeth with the new guys and their chain brake habits - tough to tell them exactly how to use it, and when. I have had those guys on my crew who snap it on full-throttle, and it definitely seems destructive, but we've not had any issues.

You might check for the consistency of the brake band thickness. I've seen a 2 wear out. I just wore out the CB band on my 192T, which is 3.5 years old, a week after the cb spring broke. On a climbing saw, I can see a bit more CB engagement when revved action, as you sometimes need to cut and reach out to catch a limb as its bending/ falling. At least I do.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

I put a face cut in this crane pick. The ball couldn't reach/ wasn't over the load by a couple feet.

That's huge for that move. Bold. How heavy a pick? How close to capacity at that distance?

So when its tipped over, and the strap is at the top end, how does the butt move as the COG comes under the hook? Is the pick lifted as you cut it, with a retainer line "lowering" the butt under the COG, or just a swing?

 

[Jason Gairn]

I meant to say when you posted it Butch, what a great picture it is.