Murphy's Step Cut

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stig said:
Merle, by "gutting it" I mean cutting the center out of the hinge.

I prefer having a hinge as two separate blocks of wood that are able to work with or against each other. Also the newer wood in a tree, near and including the sapwood is more flexible and stronger than the older heatwood, so by gutting that out I can make the hinge a bit thicker and still avoid a possible barberchair.
Does this explanation make sense, or shall I try to rephrase it?
Click to expand...

Try to read and learn myself about the mechanics of all this without comment as I truly know little in comparison but just have to point it out.

Some how possibly dyslexia Murphy but I only read thicker.
 
Tucker943 said:
He is a logger, heartwood and thin hinges decide whether he has food on his table or not.
Click to expand...
They may be important in preserving a logs value, even crucial... And that's not what he said...
"bear in mind that a thinner, more flexible hinge may well hold better in this scenario, than an unflexable beefy one!"

maybe thinner is "preferable" in some scenarios... less resistance on a back leaner and less fiber pull for the mill, but thinner does not HOLD better... nor does sapwood hold better than heartwood..
 
i think flexible is the key here. when talking about hinge wood "holding" it means bending without breaking. that is why blocking the face or using the whizzy works. and i have to say, what stig says is right on, heart wood tends to be harder and more inflexible than sapwood. inflexible is not a desirable characteristic when you want a hinge to hold as long as possible. a thicker, more brittle hinge is not ideal. all that accomplishes is a harder pull and a hinge that breaks early. forget log value and fiber pull, it is simply the mechanics of wood.
 
stig said:
They are 3 different threads, I don't know why they have the same heading in my post.

I've tried to correct it now.

Merle, by "gutting it" I mean cutting the center out of the hinge.

I prefer having a hinge as two separate blocks of wood that are able to work with or against each other. Also the newer wood in a tree, near and including the sapwood is more flexible and stronger than the older heatwood, so by gutting that out I can make the hinge a bit thicker and still avoid a possible barberchair.
Does this explanation make sense, or shall I try to rephrase it?
Click to expand...

I understand your explanation on this completely. Will read through the threads you listed and soon get Jerry’s info. on the way to me. Thank you!
 
Perhaps along the lines of what Patrick says, isn't a distinct difference between the step cut and a standard face and back cut when pulling trees, that with the standard cut where you cut a little and pull a little more, that you have the hinge holding the tree and yielding in progression as you stand up the tree and ideally get it leaning towards the lay or close to it before the hinge breaks? With the step cut, at least with a tree leaning back a lot, the likelihood is that once the step gives, you are pretty much relying on the pull to both hold the tree and get it over in rapid fashion....emphasis on rapid. Perhaps this has been mentioned before, but it seems to me that those differences can make for rather distinct desirability when applying either method, given certain factors like species, condition of wood, type of pull power, and also certain risks that might be involved given the location of the tree. Working alone or along with somebody else in combination with type of pull, could also be a consideration. One thing I have noticed about the standard and slower method, that I have pretty much always uses when pulling, especially when working alone in tight situations, is that the elevated human stress level tends to get drawn out too. :\: I could see conflict with other trees as an element as well, like when wanting to better drive a tree through another's limbs. Putting a heavy load on a tree and then getting it flying has some application.
 
Porkbrick said:
i think flexible is the key here. when talking about hinge wood "holding" it means bending without breaking. that is why blocking the face or using the whizzy works. and i have to say, what stig says is right on, heart wood tends to be harder and more inflexible than sapwood. inflexible is not a desirable characteristic when you want a hinge to hold as long as possible. a thicker, more brittle hinge is not ideal. all that accomplishes is a harder pull and a hinge that breaks early. forget log value and fiber pull, it is simply the mechanics of wood.
Click to expand...

We have a different point of view... I have plenty of experience and experimentation to back mine up... maybe its a difference in species... I mostly go with thick hinges in the poor hinging species.. never really needed them on anything else... they hold remarkably well if you have enough power to get the piece moving... also fiber pull on the stump/log clearly shows that heartwood has as much holding power or more than sapwood, as long as trhere is no heart rot.. sounds like a good case for mythbusters
 
Two tied together... I like a step-cut here on that smaller dead cherry trunk...
<iframe width="853" height="480" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/GdyenNl9f14" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
<object width="640" height="480"><param name="movie" value="//www.youtube.com/v/H8g__syN4_I?version=3&hl=en_US&rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="//www.youtube.com/v/H8g__syN4_I?version=3&hl=en_US&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="640" height="480" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>

Develop trust in your cutting and falling skills so you can use them upstairs when your life depends on it...
 
<iframe width="640" height="480" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/Qwdcr9mWbmg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Here's one I left unedited to show how fast and easy this cut is... under 2 minutes to put the tree on the ground.. and the saw was half dull.
 
Well WTH I was born on in 1948.Still at 220 but unfortunatley it's not 90 percent muscle like in the avatar pic .--chit happens and we age .On the other hand the alternative to aging being demise is not acceptable.---some day yes but not this day ---:D
 
IMO the fatter the hinge causing you to need a harder pull than otherwise necessary greatly increases the chance of something going awry. Keep reinventing the wheel in the meantime ill just keep rolling along.
 
squisher said:
IMO the fatter the hinge causing you to need a harder pull than otherwise necessary greatly increases the chance of something going awry. Keep reinventing the wheel in the meantime ill just keep rolling along.
Click to expand...

On a back leaner, or side leaner?
 
On a maple or a fir? How about a cottonweed? I don't mean to sound to sarcastic but if you look around its all been discussed to death for the most part. I'm a traditional cutter. On a side leaner ill leave a little extra meat on the tension side and gun accordingly but I'm still not a fan of a fatter than necessary hinge type of guy.

Side leakers are a whole ball game to themselves with a myriad of techniques that one can employ.
 
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