How do you align a diagonal?

[sotc]

I don't fall near as much as I used to so by saying 'B', the gut instinct part is in starting the cut. If its a tight drop zone, I don't think its cheating to look or put a twing in the far corner to verify. It just makes sense to double check before a possible mistake has been made. Easy to make a small correction than recut as a proper fix is usually cutting the entire width of the face. Like Jerry, I cut the level cut first but the more I think about it, I can understand how the angled cut first works. As long as the cut ends level, it would be fairly easy to line the level cut second but I don't see an advantage of either over the other so I do what I do

 

[Old Monkey]

Willard, I am confused by your use of "vertical." To my mind that would be a plunge cut in the back of the face. I assume you are talking about the top, sloped or angled cut?

I can see the idea behind doing your top cut first. The problem with it to me is that once its started, that's it, that's the way its facing and you cannot change it easily. I was trained in the West Coast/ Forest Service/ Douglas Dent school of thought. I chuck people's old wood wedges out into the brush just to be a jerk, ask them loaded questions that will only result in me shutting the trainees down, making them feel insecure and nervous. Oh wait, I've seen the Dent videos to many times.

 

[HolmenTree]

I looked at the Forestry thread on AS a while ago and they pretty much hold on to the opinion that if you're not from the PNW, you are not a real logger and had best shut up.

That is pretty well how I got myself banned from AS. Their 30 tree a day to my...............

Willard

 

[SkwerI]

Willard, I didn't know you were sent to Band Camp. Congratulations!

 

[stig]

I can see the idea behind doing your top cut first. The problem with it to me is that once its started, that's it, that's the way its facing and you cannot change it easily.

But why would you want to change it.

Do you often change your mind in the middle of falling a tree and decide that it would be better to drop it in another direction.

I usually make decidin on the lay part of my preliminaries, like checking for widowmakers, and making sure the saw is gassed up.

 

[Old Monkey]

Reading Willard on here, it seems pretty hard to believe he could get himself banned. That says so much more about AS that it does about Willard.

 

[bill22]

I know a few guys who just stand off to the side[referring to standing on spikes] and make their cuts all from that side.Maybe I'm missing something but unless its a small stick i can't gun it from on side and be perfect,I find it a lot easier to just spike around and make sure its perfect, especially when doing a Humboldt.

 

[Old Monkey]

But why would you want to change it.

Do you often change your mind in the middle of falling a tree and decide that it would be better to drop it in another direction.

I usually make decidin on the lay part of my preliminaries, like checking for widowmakers, and making sure the saw is gassed up.

The way I was trained was to pick a target as far away as possible, score the horizontal cut back to my quarter to a third, dog in and cut until my gunning sites point directly at my target. With the top cut you point at your target from the beginning and start cutting. It makes sense but I like the idea of being able to get my eye down to the level of the gunning site with the saw just sitting in the cut with very little effort. It just seems easier to me. I am not saying your way is wrong even though it is different and should rightfully shunned by good moral, right thinking people.

 

[Old Monkey]

Bill, I think we are mostly talking about cutting from the ground.

 

[stig]

The way I was trained was to pick a target as far away as possible, .

Is this where the expression. " shoot for the moon" comes from?

 

[Old Monkey]

Nah, the moon moves too much.

 

[HolmenTree]

Willard, I am confused by your use of "vertical." To my mind that would be a plunge cut in the back of the face. I assume you are talking about the top, sloped or angled cut?

Darin here is a sketch to explain.

Willard

 

[Burnham]

Boy, Willard...now I have to come off as a disagreeable cuss again...I have always found that hingewood down low like that in the flares is less trustworthy, due to it running out into the flares, rather than nice and straight like it will be a bit further up the stem. My experience, anyway.

 

[GASoline71]

...what works best is what you are used to doing, and be damned if someone will convince another that thus and such way is better .

Couldn't have said it better myself Burnham.

Gary

 

[HolmenTree]

Boy, Willard...now I have to come off as a disagreeable cuss again...I have always found that hingewood down low like that in the flares is less trustworthy, due to it running out into the flares, rather than nice and straight like it will be a bit further up the stem. My experience, anyway.

I have to agree with you Burnham hingewwood down low in the flare should not be used in every application , but depending on the species and condition of the wood it has its advantages.
Major thing to consider is coniferous trees support themselves primarily by compression wood in the lean side flare and decidious primarily by tension wood on the opposite to the lean flare.

Willard.

 

[stig]

You are so right Burnham.
Which is why I'll always set a high stump ( or in your terms, a normal stump) when I'm working around buildings.
But in the woods here, the trouble one gets into for hitting another tree are nothing compared to what'll hit you if you leave the first 3 feet of every veneer log standing

 

[Burnham]

Truly!

Listen, you! I only advocate a high stump when felling hazard trees, where I want to be standing up, best able to keep an eye out overhead and ready to vacate the stump quick like a bunny. For harvesting volume, nothing higher than 12 inches. Now I know to you that's a high stump, but not really that tall!

Maybe if y'all had enough decent trees you wouldn't have to crawl around in the dirt to find a few inches more stem .

 

[stig]

You mean like the oak, Anders dug out of the ground last month

 

[Burnham]

Exactly like that...I know you have some real pumpkins, Stig...you just don't have enough to meet the need, so you have to dig .


Hahahaha...this is fun!

 

[Burnham]

Trees like this...it doesn't really matter if you leave half a foot on the stump .

 

[stig]

You are right as usual. If our trees grew to 250 feet. we could afford to cut them head high, too.

Man, can we derail a thread

 

[Burnham]

Told ya it was fun!

 

[sawinredneck]

I have to agree with you Burnham hingewwood down low in the flare should not be used in every application , but depending on the species and condition of the wood it has its advantages.
Major thing to consider is coniferous trees support themselves primarily by compression wood in the lean side flare and decidious primarily by tension wood on the opposite to the lean flare.

Willard.

OK, I'm gonna run with this one as I have some questions, and a tree coming up that I'm going to have to remove fairly soon.
It's a Red Cedar that has been lightning struck at least once, I'm thinking twice. 32"ish at the base, the lean is towards the house, and it will collapse the house, it's that close! I'm going to rope high and pull it with the mini and it has to land across a driveway and miss a parking lot the other side of the house.
As this is a "loosing job", little money, more helping someone out deal, I'd like to get in and out quickly and take it like the picture below:

You mean like the oak, Anders dug out of the ground last month

But being that close the house, I want to make sure I have control and make the sucker go where it needs to be! Is cutting into the flair questionable with this species? Should I just bite the bullet, cut it high then make another stump cut to clean it up?
Sorry for the stupid questions and the derail Burnham!

 

[stig]

Cut it high then alap it. Take the safe route.

That would be my take on it.

 

[Burnham]

As if we don't derail with abandon around here, Andy!

My first choice would be to make the felling cut somewhat higher and then alap it.

I have no idea if your red cedar is the same as my red cedar, but if it is, it'll have large flares that run the fiber off at significant angles to the stem, and hinge poorly. Red cedar doesn't hinge all that well anyway, sort of a brittle wood.

It also has a propensity to heart and butt rots, and you will perhaps get better wood up a bit from the ground for this reason, too. Boring before you decide where to place your felling cut could give you feedback on that condition.