Pulling wood out of the brush?

I've replaced the 2 section pump with the single section pump and have it workingish, but I do have a couple things to figure out.

Firstly, the GPS said it topped out at 5.3mph, which is flippin great by me.

Here's the factory schematics:
Thomashydroschematics.jpg


Here's what I tried:
Disconnected line 26 from the dump valve (fitting 19), and connected it straight to the pump. I thought this would kill two birds, one, it'd bypass the silly safety chit (dump valve), and it'd get the fluid straight to the valves in the most direct manner. That didn't work for reasons unknown. The engine stalled, obviously the fluid is working against itself somewhere.

So, what I did was return line 26 to fitting 19, connect fitting 33 (right) to pump while capping the other 33 (left).

Now the fluid is going back through the dump valve and the circuit breaker valve (13).

Before I push the safety interlock button (for the main hydraulics), the engine runs/idles fine. There's no undue load on the engine like the pump is having to work against inline restrictions going from its outlet to through the circuit breaker and dump valve to tank. When I push the interlock button, closing the dump valve and running fluid through hose 26, the engine sounds like it has a slight load against it. If I try to feather a control, the loading increase. If I run the controls wide open, there is the initial increase in load which then decreases as the machine gets to speed.

All the hoses are 3/8", and it happens if the engine is at idle, WOT, or anywhere in between. That lets me know it's not from too much flow going through the valves, as at idle the pump puts out less fluid than the original at WOT.

I'm miffed why I couldn't run hose 26 straight to the pump, so I'm guessing it has something to do with the over center valve in both configurations.

I'll make a video to better illustrate how the machine is acting.

Another question, does anyone know the in tank strainer's filter number?
 
I think where you screwed up the first time: Connection 8, line 52 is the feed and connection 8 line 26 is the return. Fluid comes in, one or more valves are open it takes that path, in none are open it just flows through and returns through the dump valve.
Let me study the other one and I will try and help on it in a min.
 
Ok, part two.
What is happening is you are "dead heading" against the cap on 33 left instead of putting the fluid through the system. If you track 33 and 42 you see they end up being tied together then recirculating through the two speed valve. I think this is the added load and creating some of the jerkiness you are getting.
 
Got another thread going over here.

I think where you screwed up the first time: Connection 8, line 52 is the feed and connection 8 line 26 is the return. Fluid comes in, one or more valves are open it takes that path, in none are open it just flows through and returns through the dump valve.
Let me study the other one and I will try and help on it in a min.

26 is the feed, 52 is the out. I was dead heading against the over center valve as it wasn't receiving pressure through 53 which is its pilot.


Ok, part two.
What is happening is you are "dead heading" against the cap on 33 left instead of putting the fluid through the system. If you track 33 and 42 you see they end up being tied together then recirculating through the two speed valve. I think this is the added load and creating some of the jerkiness you are getting.

I thought about that, but normally operating, the low side of the pump would be pumping against 33 left also. I've tried figuring out if/how that would make a difference, and I still don't see how it does.

The jerkiness was me, not the machine (stopping all the sudden). I can still feather the controls, but that increases the load on the engine. I'm going to connect line 38 to line 52 and put 26 back on the pump and see what happens. That will cut the circuit separator, dump, and over center valves out of the picture. That will let me know if the restriction is in the valve bank (doubtful since it happens at idle when the flow is minimal) or if it's with the over center valve not being happy.

Why did you replace the 2 section pump with a single section pump?

The second section of the pump powers the "loader mounted aux." which is on the machine. I never use that circuit, so there's no point in circulating that oil round and round. (The grapple is ran off "Aux 2nd" in the valve bank).

If Surplus Center would have had the correct rotation and configuration double pump, I'dda stuck it in there. Alas, they didn't.

ETA: I'm fairly confident there isn't a case drain for the valves (37).
 
As soon as you mentioned the 2 section pump I thought they would have one section for driving the vehicle and one for the rest of the hydraulics. Silly me. Good luck.
 
That's how it is in our stump grinders, but not with the Thomas. That's how they make 2 speeds, connecting the low side of the pump to the valve bank (low speed) and the high side to the loader mounted aux.
 
Connecting line 52 to fitting 25, and 26 to the pump's outlet removed the restriction, which leads me to deduce the restriction was in the over center valve.

The "overdrive" may prove too much, in which case I'll get a smaller single section to install (less overdrive) so I can reach higher pressures.
 
Yeeehaw log is 13" on the small end, 8.5' long Cedar, about 375 lbs +200lbs of grapple. The overdrive from the pump is a bit too much, so I'm thinking of replacing the .98"^3 pump with a .73"^3 or .85"^3 pump:
 
Installed a smaller pump today, still 32% more flow than the stock single section, but it won't stall the motor now @ 3ksi.

Going to run it a few days to make sure everything is happy, then pull out all the old junk to clean it up and make room for a better filtration system. The in tank filter is a joke.
 
No problem Dave, glad I could help! I remember what a PITA it was when I was trying to find it!
 
Back
Top