Production Falling - Bucking length Tolerance?
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That chapter really hit home with me.
I remember reading it for the first time and thinking: " Yes, yes, that is it exactly".
Every time I get a new apprentice, I lend them my copy of High Climbers and Timber fallers, and it totally blows their little minds away
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Altissimus
TreeHouser
Goes pretty quick for a job as they pretty much can eyeball lengths then measure DIB small end and then Grade , there's an old thread maybe still around about the one time we got Scaled on the landing while the Truck loaded ... if we liked the price he cut us a check on the spot , if not they would unload and leave empty ... anything that made Veneer was free trucking ... we helped driving in those plastic things into the ends.
Mill makes money on every cubic inch of trim. It all adds up.
Bark, softwood/hardwood chips, sawdust. It all gets sold. Finger joint machines turn short sticks into longer ones.
If you ever buy hardwood flooring you get a few short pieces in the bundle.
Bark, softwood/hardwood chips, sawdust. It all gets sold. Finger joint machines turn short sticks into longer ones.
If you ever buy hardwood flooring you get a few short pieces in the bundle.
Havent worked at a mill for 20+ years, and please, someone correct me if I'm wrong: doesnt the scaler measure BF at the small end of a log? Shorter logs with less taper would seem to be more lucrative for the faller, vs if you get paid a premium for longer length, say > 18'
stikine
Treehouser
Scaling methods vary depending on what region you are in. Scribner around here which is small end. At one point in time we were cubic scaling which required both small and large diameter measurements, scalers hated that.
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Looks like Doyle is small end too. I pulled up an article to get a feel for the process. That, and my later question was prompted by Attissimus' comment on a 'slippery stick' if you weren't a favored provider.
Short logs and firewood are stacked here and scaled photographically.
They take a picture of both ends of the stack, a computer programme configurates it into solid mass.
Hard to cheat with that.
Been years and years since I've had a scaling dispute.
Still feel cheated, though
They take a picture of both ends of the stack, a computer programme configurates it into solid mass.
Hard to cheat with that.
Been years and years since I've had a scaling dispute.
Still feel cheated, though
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Owner of local mill has become rather wealthy by virtue of business smarts and hard work. . .and a scaler who could beat a logger down on both scale AND grade!
Unless you brought in a whole load of veneer logs, you would get #1sawlog $$. Any veneer logs would get separated and accumulated untill such time there were sufficient quantity to get a veneer buyer to drop by.
Shortly after I got going full time in treework, the mill put scales in and started buying by weight.
Unless you brought in a whole load of veneer logs, you would get #1sawlog $$. Any veneer logs would get separated and accumulated untill such time there were sufficient quantity to get a veneer buyer to drop by.
Shortly after I got going full time in treework, the mill put scales in and started buying by weight.
gf beranek
Old Schooler
Stud lengths are set in 8 foot multiples. Thus a 40 foot log would have five 8 foot multiples. Totally 40 feet, plus 1 foot of trim 41 feet.
The bad thing about stud-lengths is, as the mill goes, a 40 foot log that is short by 1 inch of trim would be down-graded to a 32 foot log. Even though the mill can still saw 5 multiples out of the log they only pay you for a 32 foot log. That's how the mills steal from loggers. All legally. It's in the fine print of the contract.
I could go on.
The bad thing about stud-lengths is, as the mill goes, a 40 foot log that is short by 1 inch of trim would be down-graded to a 32 foot log. Even though the mill can still saw 5 multiples out of the log they only pay you for a 32 foot log. That's how the mills steal from loggers. All legally. It's in the fine print of the contract.
I could go on.
Richard and I logged a bunch of Larch about 15 years ago.
One of us had a tape measure that was off by 2".
( We never found out which of us it was, because by the time the complaint from the mill rolled in, we had both switched tapes)
That meant they downgraded the entire shipment to the nearest measure that fit.
Cost us about 2 grand.
Anyone here want to bet against them just sending out boards that were slightly short?
One of us had a tape measure that was off by 2".
( We never found out which of us it was, because by the time the complaint from the mill rolled in, we had both switched tapes)
That meant they downgraded the entire shipment to the nearest measure that fit.
Cost us about 2 grand.
Anyone here want to bet against them just sending out boards that were slightly short?
gf beranek
Old Schooler
I remember that.
And even being 2 inches short on trim still leaves the mill with 4 inches of trim to saw off.
Boy they showed you.
And even being 2 inches short on trim still leaves the mill with 4 inches of trim to saw off.
Boy they showed you.
Altissimus
TreeHouser
Comes down to cutting and presenting the best log for value , many times it's an 8' ... in New England the money is in the Butts
Altissimus
TreeHouser
Though Softwoods here are a much easier game , only two Grades and mostly two lengths
gf beranek
Old Schooler
As old-growth goes in the Pacific northwest the butt logs were rife with defects and oftenculled. Second logs were more times clear of defects and knots, and commanded top price. third logs and up had more knots and were graded accordingly.
Jed
TreeHouser
Here’s what a guy misses when he don’t log into the House.
Dave Shepard
Square peg, round world.
I spec 6" up to 14', then I like to see 8-10" on 16' and up. Then in the 20's, 30's, 40's etc., a foot+. I'm sawing timbers, but I don't want 28' side lumber, so a little extra trim lets me cut the boards into common dimensions. We're not dealing in 40' sticks here, except for the crazy timber framers, so the trim isn't going to mess you up too bad. In hardwoods, an inch or two might just make the difference, so you pay attention there.
flushcut
TreeHouser
The mills I've delt with like 9" of trim. 8'9" 16'9"......ect
Altissimus
TreeHouser
There's another mill in Mass. I have sold to that has an interesting approach. Not the highest prices but they will take just about any sound log as getting rid of low grade can be challenging , having their own Pallet Shop helps ... they will also scale Balsam Fir as Spruce (nice for the logger but I wouldn't buy framing from them) ... the stuff that doesn't even make Pallet grade can be cut to 10's w trim and go to Tie Stock for the railroad ... also have a bandsaw mill where they can saw out around heart rot or hollow centers which gets them boards from a log they hardly paid anything for.
Altissimus
TreeHouser
It's like Casinos , it always is in favor of the house , their add says owned by a "heritage family" (code for Rednecks) Buying stumpage they will either lump sum you in advance or go through the process and you'll get mill checks. Buyer actually offered me a job chopping for them which gave me more insight. Own half a dozen Skidders and a couple Log Trucks ... if you chop for them they provide a marked lot , and the Skidder for you and your pay is by the thousand on the landing
Altissimus
TreeHouser
It's not easy work and every lot is different (some are just boundary flagged and you cut everything over 8" DBH) ... one can do pretty good for them but you're chopping and driving ... you have to be into it I guess , I'm not a great machine operator. Bright side is they fix it when it breaks
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