its time for me to upgrade my style.

[Tucker943]

I had a hard time finding the right words. Not a stub per say. I've been bit in the butt by stubs. More like certain limbs with the right collar to them. Enough that I can, with a lanyard, get them climb line on them enough to sit my downward weight on them, make my cut above them, move down the tree on the opposite side to my next spot. I emphasize with my lanyard. It's hard to describe with words, but not something that pictures wouldn't make totally clear. I don't leave all cuts like that. More like making a collar cut on selected spots that I know I'm going to want to work off of on my way back down. But not something is rappell down to my next cut without having my lanyard still around the spar. Some guys don't mind working a big saw off their lanyard. Me, I'm partial to wanting to work with my weight supported by my leg straps.

 

[Tucker943]

I hate rappelling off of a notch in the wood. I've been there and prefer other methods.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

I get ya Chris.. I often leave a little more bulge on a collar just to set my FC on or to help with rigging a spar down. Just something that will help keep a dead eye or rigging from slipping down.

 

[Tucker943]

On conifers with no rope work, just skin em and dump the top, and block them down, I do leave some 2 inch stubs. I'm not ashamed to say that. Only on one side of the tree though, and only where I plan on making a pitstop on my way back down to dump a piece of spar off. It's not 100% ideal and by the book, but it gives me spots to rap off of, and it speeds up my journey back down the spar.

 

[Tucker943]

I get ya Chris.. I often leave a little more bulge on a collar just to set my FC on or to help with rigging a spar down. Just something that will help keep a dead eye or rigging from slipping down.

bingo. You know what I'm struggling to describe. Wasn't it you that I sold an 044 to with a burnt top end? I'm struggling to remember.

 

[PCTREE]

Setting a TIP directly into another rope is risky territory. very slow descents,,, and short .

I fully understand the inherent risk but as stated I have never seen even any glazing on the rope.... Wait till Burnham sees this....

 

[Tucker943]

Is B going to scold me or you?

 

[bonner1040]

I saw a interesting method in one of Frei's videos. He choked the single line to the spar with a running bowline and left a long tail on the bowline, long enough to get to the next cut... So he would block off a piece to make the top of the spar even with his TIP, lower down a bit, 5-6 feet whatever, to where the tail hung down to. Throw the hip lanyard around and then pull down on that tail which loosens the running bowline enough to slide it down.

I havent used it in practice but it seems like it would work in theory. Does anyone do anything similar when working the spar SRT ?

 

[Climbinfool.]

yes, tiss the way I move down a stick or use a adjustable FC, but primarily srt. Quick and efficient.

 

[Jack]

I saw a interesting method in one of Frei's videos. He choked the single line to the spar with a running bowline and left a long tail on the bowline, long enough to get to the next cut... So he would block off a piece to make the top of the spar even with his TIP, lower down a bit, 5-6 feet whatever, to where the tail hung down to. Throw the hip lanyard around and then pull down on that tail which loosens the running bowline enough to slide it down.

I havent used it in practice but it seems like it would work in theory. Does anyone do anything similar when working the spar SRT ?

Yup: {EDIT: pix are a couple of years old ... use a RIG now with the same technique}

 

[bonner1040]

Thanks Jack. Those are greats pics.

 

[Porkbrick]

that is the method i was trying (poorly) to describe in my last post. it can work very well.more commonly i will spur down to my next cut and choke my climbline as high as i can reach. this allows me to hang some or all of my weight on my rope while putting in my face cut and tying off the rigging (if there is rigging).

 

[Climbinfool.]

Nice Pics Jack.

I don't use a GriGri though. For descending it's ok, but I found if I have to go up any distance, it can be a pain to pull up your slack.So, I just keep using a FP. with a micro pulley.

 

[treesandsurf]

Cool thread. I'll restate what was said in the very beginning. If I am working with a new climber we'll usually start off with a blake's hitch and then into a distel hitch. I've always felt like the distel is the most trust worthy in terms of grabbing the line after tension has been taken off. Of course rope type and size will play a factor but I don't trust sending a new climber up on a VT, too touchy.

jp

 

[treesandsurf]

Not saying you're a new climber, but new to the closed hitch type of systems.

jp

 

[rskybiz]

a most excellent saturday read

 

[Tucker943]

This has been an awesome thread.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Has been?

 

[bonner1040]

It was

Does it continue?

Tucker, we need a follow up review of your findings!

 

[PCTREE]

Snowed here today, took kids for a walk by the river and as always was looking at all the big trees, kinda idly planning how I would get around them. As I looked at a big sycamore with 2 big leaders I was thinking I would probably come out of one top and Wraptor up other side instead of trying to work my way over there. Then a thought occurred to me, maybe old hat to you SRT dudes but new to me, Couldn't you just throw the tail of your rope over the other lead and have groundy anchor it then you could ride your rope like a zip line to traverse , could even go tree to tree like this right??

Just a thought on a slow day...

 

[Tucker943]

No chance to dabble yet. I'm at a standstill for work. It's been this way for a week and looks like it'll be a bit.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Then a thought occurred to me, maybe old hat to you SRT dudes but new to me, Couldn't you just throw the tail of your rope over the other lead and have groundy anchor it then you could ride your rope like a zip line to traverse , could even go tree to tree like this right??

Just a thought on a slow day...

Yes... or already have another line shot in and traverse over double crotched so to speak. Today I threw the tail of the rope through a crotch on the other leader of a black walnut and had him anchor me so I could just pull me into it....

 

[Burnham]

Tucker you old school climber you. Now heres a trick to consider (I never leave stubs, ever. The guy who taught me always said nothing good ever comes of a stub!!) Now I shoulder even admit I do this with all the far superior technical climbers here but here goes. When you tie your pull line at the top of the spar with a running bowline, below that tie a loop with an overhand knot and then just tie into that. Obviously if I was Carl I wouldn't fly down the spar 60' because of wear to the rope but I have done this for years , always descended slowly and have never seen even any glazing to the rope. I commonly tie in like this, come down to where my next cut is and make my face cut whilst I am still tied in as it takes the weight off of your hooks. Probably not what the safety instructors would teach but it works for me.....

Setting a TIP directly into another rope is risky territory. very slow descents,,, and short .

I fully understand the inherent risk but as stated I have never seen even any glazing on the rope.... Wait till Burnham sees this....

Ok...Burnham has seen this .

No matter how careful you are with this rope on rope tie in Paul, it's waaaaay off the reservation, as you seem to be well aware. And yet you persist, and I cannot fathom why.

Not when there is an easy way to do the same thing far more safely, if we ignore that mixing rigging lines and life support lines is just about as far off the rez as the other thing....

All you need to carry extra is a single steel rigging ring. After you set the pull line, just girth hitch the ring on that line under the running bowline and tie your DRT system through that. Work the spar the same as you've been doing with the rope loop, except you don't have to be so cautious on the raps. Groundie doesn't need to do anything to the ring when he unties the piece he's just pulled over...just send the pull rope back up and you're in business again.

Make sense?

 

[Burnham]

Pictures.

 

[stig]

Man, that hip of yours must be really be bad now, if you are having to rappell down your file cabinets

When I first read that description of rapelling down using a rope as TIP, I didn't understand it.
Then when I understood what was meant, I simply couldn't believe it

Even simply adding a carabiner would make it safer than going rope on rope.