How Big A Swing Are You Willing To Take Before Saying "No!"?

[treesmith]

Brian, I was ~50’ away holding my phone and filming from the truck as I pulled it.

What Stig said. I set two lines in the top to guy it until ready. Climbed and made a face cut and high back cut and set pull line below notch (also rappelled down on it). Then hooked pull line to truck, face cut and high back cut the stump, released the top line on the off side (freeing the top), and pulled trunk. Essentially fit a ~50’ dead pine into a 30’drop zone. Had it been a bit less dead, I’d have climbed a bit higher and shot for 1/2 length drop zone. As it was I went for a 20%/40%. House/power line on one side, many flowers/shrubs they didn’t want damaged, as well as surrounded by other pines he didn’t want damaged.

 

[Mick!]

It’s a pretty good technique I’ve never seen before.

 

[gf beranek]

Graeme Mcmahon did a short vid called "Folding Tree". I've used it a few times. Probably more to pull limb locked trees out of others. In which case it works the same, but you generally don't have to put a line in the top, since it's limb locked. Good trick to have in the tool box.

 

[treesmith]

I’ve only used it for dead pines. Eliminates having to climb as high in a compromised tree. I’ve toyed with the idea of a 3-piece cut but the pull required would be tricky as the two cuts would move at different speeds.

As far as I know, I’d never seen/heard of it. I’d cut/folded/dropped hang-ups before as Jerry mentioned, though and it seemed like it would work well, assuming one was careful. It’s worked fine for me, though there’s a lot that could go wrong if the cuts failed prematurely. Hence the guy lines.

 

[treesmith]

Essentially, if you have “almost enough” room to throw the top, and have some room behind for the butt section, it’s a viable solution.

I wouldn’t recommend it for sprawling/limby trees.

 

[gf beranek]

Those are good points to remember. Yeah, a lot can go wrong if you fail to engineer it right.

 

[treesmith]

I have used a skyline a couple of times, but it doesn’t appear you have near enough nor tall enough trees to make that an option. It’s difficult to get a skyline taut enough to support sour weight without a lot of snag unless it’s a very short span. I have set three guy lines on sketchy dead trees to give me more “security” before heading up. Problem is, it’s dangerous trying to throw a top without hitting one of the guys which could be catastrophic. I have used a nearby green tree for my TIP, and kept a short line threaded through an 8 in case I had to bail out, just for braking effect. Never had to use it thankfully.

 

[Altissimus]

Guy lines from three sides , like ... you're right though , limiting free falling work

 

[Altissimus]

I've used one of the winches and a Gibbs to tension the skyline

 

[treesmith]

If the skyline is spanned between two tall trees in the wee tops though, that’s a lot of side load. Could guy them as well I suppose. I’ve only used skylines on short/compromised trees, heavy leaners, and storm trees that were already fallen/suspended.

 

[gf beranek]

Spiderman.

 

[pete mctree]

I have folded a few trees and it is quite an involved process, especially when you have lines set to break the top out and pull the stem over and more. I have had some great success and a big failure when a head went sideways - I had underestimated the strength of a vine climbing through the tips 🙁

Climbing and managing dead trees is a hard thing to guide someone through, as it is so dependant of species, how long they have been dead, degree of decay etc, the list is long and many points learned through hands on experience.

 

[SeanKroll]

I fold trees now and then at head high and ground level...a good trick in some situations where a hung- up tree is unavoidable.

Keeps the angle of the lodged trunk flatter.





Haven't folded one up high, yet.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Willie (SOTC) has.

 

[Burnham]

I recall that too, Stephen. He had a good video, I think.

 

[Burnham]

Willie's fold is in this collection of short clips of some of his fells...right at just under 1 minute in. In searching the TH files, this was all I could find. I know there was a longer vid and post describing the process. Maybe Willie will chime in.

www.youtube.com/embed/1nRwahZmmZY?rel=0

 

[SeanKroll]

@sotc

 

[pigwot]

Nice!
I think I described here one I did long before I carried a phone or even a camera. It was one of seven large dead trees on this estate which we took down. A partially uprooted, totally dead 135 ft tulip poplar about 40” dbh at about a 60* angle lodged in the top of another tree on a hillside across a rocky ravine leading down to the Brandywine River across from the Hagley Museum. They wanted that tree dropped into the ravine and left there.
I set lines in trees either side of it and walked halfway up. Pulled up the 1 1/4” rigging line that extended the Lewis winch cable, wrapped it twice around, and secured it. Below that I cut a wide open face on the top of the trunk, and undercut it leaving a pretty good hinge . Exited the tree and using a three foot bar cut a face under the base of the trunk above the soon-to-be stump, and backcut in till I had about a two to three inch hinge. Then we all got out of Dodge except the fellow well beyond the top running the winch.
Took all that winch had to snap the upper hinge, the base hinge followed and it folded right onto itself.
I’ve only folded three that I can think of in all.

 

[pantheraba]

Good description...cool plan.

 

[Marc-Antoine]

But that's even trickier to determine the thickness of the middle hinge, ready to go but not too soon. Dead, uprooted, heavy leaner and hung-up, that begins to make a lot to deal with.

 

[gf beranek]

Nice description. Real puzzle

 

[pigwot]

I only wish I’d at least had a camera for still shots. Though not the most massive, it was likely the most creative falling I’ve done. You don’t often get that much drama in residential work in my area.

 

[Eric H-L]

A ground-worker can 'belay' your SRT tail to prevent you from hitting the anchor tree. Easy work, sitting in a chair in the safe area.

I appreciate the cautions about unanticipated swings and strategies to mitigate the risk. I was at a recreational climb recently getting some tips from experienced professional climbing arborists. I tried a limb walk way out the end with a good high TIP, and slipped off. I swung back into the tree hard. Fortunately, not seriously hurt but bruised my ribs. I could have gotten a concussion or a neck injury. Definitely want to be belayed in future.

 

[SeanKroll]

And a swing into a stub can break a rib that could puncture a lung.

A sharp stub could puncture a body.

I clean stubs before limbwalking swinging from one tree to another tree for sure.

 

[Altissimus]

I appreciate the cautions about unanticipated swings and strategies to mitigate the risk. I was at a recreational climb recently getting some tips from experienced professional climbing arborists. I tried a limb walk way out the end with a good high TIP, and slipped off. I swung back into the tree hard. Fortunately, not seriously hurt but bruised my ribs. I could have gotten a concussion or a neck injury. Definitely want to be belayed in future.

... brings thread back to the title , I don't do swings of any size that much at all. I can get out to most branche tips if I have to , but try to avoid that as well (sometimes no avoiding it piecing one out or tip rigging for the winch)as I consider myself a mediocre limb walker. When I do it seems alot of time and effort because I'll sling and advance a safety under the limb as well in addition to dealing with climbline ... had great luck getting the climbline out further from the stem through crotches of other limbs or sling redirects