Cold starting loader

emr

emr

Cheesehead Treehouser
Joined
Nov 5, 2006
Messages
2,193
Location
Neenah, Wisconsin
Last winter we bought our little loader and it's been amazing! The down side has been that it's very cold blooded and doesn't like to get going when temps drop below 25 or so. Tomorrow it's supposed to be below zero with wind chills all day and we really need the loader for a willow removal. Today I bought a propane torpedo heater to try and heat the engine up in the morning. In the past I've tried to heat the engine up with a barn heater like shown in the pic. That was blowing heat on the carb and air intake. Is that the best place to heat or should I blow it in the back end of the machine. That would put the heat on the fins that blow around. I wish I had a pic so it would make more sense.... I don't really know what all of the technical terms are here. I labeled A to show where I have been heating and B to show the rear of the machine. Thoughts?
e49d7f51a6b414f02688c759822d7bc2.jpg
8dcad6f57289d1a9da2ba5bc25ed5a88.jpg


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  • #4
It's a 22 hp Robin (Subaru) gas engine.
I should have mentioned that we don't have power where we store it. We usually bring along a generator to power the heater once we get to the job site. We also have a little magnetic block heater thing that we use to try to heat up the oil with. Nothing has worked well yet.

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I would be wondering why a gas engine is having problems in the cold. If you have compression, spark, and fuel it has to fire. Assuming it has the correct oil on it, not some super heavy diesel oil in it (I know people that run the same oil in everything) where it's not getting lubrication on start, I wouldn't hesitate to bump it with starting fluid because of the gas air mix being the likely culprit due to the cold problems only. Only thing I can think of is the carb isn't adjusted to run when very cold, or some condensation issue or something.

A truck that might work if condensation is the issue would be a hair dryer in the intake. Very handy diesel engine trick, because a diesel requires heat from compression to run, so warming the intake air is a cheap way to get it because of the compression ratios. It might work here because it would warm the air to the carb, which is where I am guessing the problem is.

Also I would add some sea foam to the tank, might help if water is an issue like this.
 
I'm guessing the EPA regulated carb is set too lean. Most likely there will be limited (if any) adjustment, just like our chainsaws. Inspect the choke mechanism and make sure it's working correctly. If not, you can remove the air filter and dribble a little gas down the intake. You can also manually block off the air intake with your gloved hand to mimic the choke operation (be aware it may spit a flame back out the intake from the gas or starting fluid).

A longer term fix will be to find a way to adjust the carb so it runs properly. You may need to run a larger jet to get more fuel.
 
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  • #7
From what I understand the Robin engines are know for this problem. People put Kohler engines on these machines and have better results. Again, from what I understand, the engine it trying to run a bunch of hydraulic pumps and the cold hydraulic fluid is the culprit. I'm definitely no mechanic, but in the summer this engine stats up faster than the Kohler on our chipper or the Vanguard on our stump grinder.

We try starting fluid and that helps a little bit, but not much. We also have hooked up a battery jumper which seems to help more. The fact of the matter is that it should be stored inside but we don't have that luxury.

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  • #9
Good question. I'm not sure off hand. It's whatever was in when we bought it. We changed the filter but have not done anything with the fluid yet.

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I have a small (40,000 btu) forced air propane heater for the really cold start days when I can't plug stuff in at night. Fuel additives might help.
 
The engine in my first car was a flat tween with a central carb. The steel air intake were too long and the gas condensed in the cold weather. First I used to put an electric air heater (from the bathroom) under the car to warm up all the engine. It worked but that wasn't really practical. After, I wrapped an heating cord around the both pipes of the intake. In the morning, I just plugged an extension cord to it and some minutes after, it can start. The record was -27*C this winter.
I was lucky to park my car just beside my small apartment, so the electricity was handy.

If not, I'd vote for a small propane blower (one which doesn't need electricity to work!) and a tarp over the engine compartment, so it warm up the engine and the hydraulics. Don't heat too hard, because the gas tank is in there too.
 
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  • #13
BlackSmith said:
It would be nice if there was an electric clutch between the engine and pump/pumps.
Click to expand...
No kidding. Biggest flaw in the design that I noticed. But I guess it keeps the cost down that way.

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  • #14
flushcut said:
I have a small (40,000 btu) forced air propane heater for the really cold start days when I can't plug stuff in at night. Fuel additives might help.
Click to expand...
I'm about to take off for work to see if our heater will work.... Wish me luck.

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I had random issues with my thomas. one time i used a 6" drainage pipe hooked over my exhaust on the truck and blew hot hair at the engine. Worked a charm.

Your truck looks like its parked on the correct side already :thumbup:
 
I used to keep a 5 foot long piece of 4" schedule 40 in my pickup just for that brendon. That was back when staying home because of cold weather was not an option for me.
 
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  • #21
Well we got it running very fast this morning. Unfortunately it wasn't a great test of the heater because it ended up not getting as cold as it was supposed to. It was about 15 degrees when we started work. I just blew the torpedo heater towards the carb and put a tarp over the entire engine. It worked like a chap. No need for starter fluid or the battery jumper. I probably let it heat up for 15 or 20 minutes. Just long enough to get everything else ready for the day.

I run full synthetic in everything we own. I plan on switching out the hydraulic fluid to Amsoil too this winter to see if that will help any.

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Citroen 2 CV ?
Click to expand...
Close, same sort of engine, but it was the next generation : Citroen Visa. It didn't seem to have much more power (actually it had, but the car weighted more, so...), but the interior looked amazingly comfy and modern when you came from the 2 cv:/:
 
I've had 1 Citroen 2CV and 4 Citroen Meharis plus 1 Renault 4 and a Renault 5.

Like Jay Leno says: " Germany was the birth place of the automobile, but France was the nursery"
 
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