Cables and bolts

[Marc-Antoine]

With the wind, you get all sorts of motions and they are amplified by the giant leverage of the limb. Back and forth, sideway, rotations with wide and short radius... The cabling stops only a small part of that and nearly all come down to the crotch with a tremendous force. A split crotch can't stay put by itself and continues to move more and more, widening the split.
The bolts stabilize that, lock the faces of the split and force the above fibers to do their job of dampening the wind's assaults.
No wind, no need of bolts, the cabling would be enough for the gravity.

 

[cory]

That makes sense too

 

[pigwot]

I am not opposed to cabling, though I hesitated to cable brace certain species, especially Liriodendron tulipfera and Acer sacharrinum as they tended to rot around the invasive metal eye bolts. Recently using the Yale Guardian synthetic cabling system I will 'cable' even those, as a failure precaution, if the affected tree is over a strike zone.

Over the past few years I have ended up removing some trees which I had rod and/or cable braced in the 20 to 25 years ago time period.
I always explained to my clients that it was an attempt at adding some years to the tree's lifespan, but their tree needed yearly checking, and if there was further decline and/or splitting and movement the tree would need to be removed. I have not (knock on wood) had any claims related to the many cabling and bracing interventions I have done over the years.

If the tree was likely to remain a high-likelihood hazard I would refuse to cable/brace it. Only one time do I recall a major failure: a large Linden, due to a microburst situation, where the stress on the tree caused it to cataclysmically fail. The two 1" diameter (48" long and 52" long through-bolts in the main crotch split were bent and exposed, though held the two halves together despite the upper portion of both leaders being shredded. Cable bracing wouldn't have saved the tree either way, as on the same estate there were five other trees either uprooted or destroyed due to the intensity of the storm.

A couple years back a client called to say they were selling their house to move into a retirement community. During the writing of their seller's disclosure they got to the point of describing the exterior of the house and were noting how a branch had failed on a Robinia pseudoacacia requiring the replacement of a section of the roof, along with reduction and cable/rod bracing of the mature tree. Rather than pass the risk on to the new owners they asked me to come re-assess the integrity of the tree.

Soundings and cores showed a decline in the amount of solid material in the trunk of the tree. We decided to remove the tree, and the interesting thing was that the rod-braced area had done quite well. I took the sections of tree with the bolts and rods home and split them to see the extent of decay and it was surprising how hard it was to extricate them.

The Wye oak had a whole lot of cables in it before it finally failed.

 

[treelooker]

Soundings and cores showed a decline in the amount of solid material in the trunk of the tree. We decided to remove the tree, and the interesting thing was that the rod-braced area had done quite well. I took the sections of tree with the bolts and rods home and split them to see the extent of decay and it was surprising how hard it was to extricate them.

There ya go; silly for an arborist not to have support systems in your toolbag.

Re: to bolt or not bolt--for an open crack it is strongly recommended.

 

[cory]

Dang I have another one that came up. I got rid of the last one, too busy.

I really don't want to buy all the gear and go thru the hoops. Its a huge ash, gonna die soon anyway from eab, they won't treat it, they're afraid of it already, too close to neighbor's property who hates them already. These normally only come up maybe every 5 years in the last 35.

 

[Merle Nelson]

There's your answer on this trees fate. Now you just have to tell them why they agree with you.

 

[cory]

I probably come across as a low class tree guy tree killer in the last post but, idk, people aren't going to want to pay for bolting and more cables. Most of the time i'm a very strong proponent of saving trees.

Ok, here's a question that lots of you here can probably render a good opinion on despite no pics etc: Large ash, 38"x80', next to a parking lot and a barn and a property line, excellent bucket access. Tree has one cable in it. How much $ to add another cable and install 2 bolts in the old split main crotch 20'-25' up. A price with profit in it.

 

[MasterBlaster]

The cost of materials plus whatever your time and equipment are worth.

 

[Burnham]

Many, many thousands of dollars, duh . And no promises that it'll last out the week.

 

[SeanKroll]

Sounds like it has to be optimal to reach with a 60' WH bucket. Your cable should be around 60'.

 

[brendonv]

Cory, ive got the drill bit for rigguy cable install, plus a roll of cable to save you from buying a roll. Lemme know.

 

[kevin bingham]

Some, but not many will do it.
Most of us won't.

Germany is very different, there was some kind of strap in just about every tree. didn't see any cables but lots of cobra style straps. like every tree.

 

[stig]

Germany IS very different.
They have a complete different approach to tree care down there.

Danes are too cheap to pay for anything in the way of trimming or cabling...........they just go the removal way.

That was one reason doing the certification test in Germany was so interesting.

 

[cory]

Cory, ive got the drill bit for rigguy cable install, plus a roll of cable to save you from buying a roll. Lemme know.

Thanks B. I'm more interested in the bracing stuff- 4' drill bit, etc.

 

[cory]

Even typing "4' drill bit" makes me think, yeah, nah, its not going to happen via me. Call Bartlett, they won't bat an eye about pruning this tree, add another cable, install 2 bolts $2500.00

 

[flushcut]

I probably come across as a low class tree guy tree killer in the last post but, idk, people aren't going to want to pay for bolting and more cables. Most of the time i'm a very strong proponent of saving trees.

Ok, here's a question that lots of you here can probably render a good opinion on despite no pics etc: Large ash, 38"x80', next to a parking lot and a barn and a property line, excellent bucket access. Tree has one cable in it. How much $ to add another cable and install 2 bolts in the old split main crotch 20'-25' up. A price with profit in it.

I usually do a flat rate $300 per cable and $150 a rod, regardless of length for either. But you may want to go higher as there are targets involved.

 

[cory]

300 hundo is good for the cable but $150 for all that drilling and screwing and etc etc? Cant your average cable be put in far faster and probably a bit cheaper on materials than a big ass rod?

 

[Mellow]

I typically get about $600-$800 per cable or rod. Plus a few hundred or more for the pruning/lightening/reduction that goes with it.

 

[cory]

That's sounding more like it, imo, for the rods. If you are getting $600+ for a cable, well how bout come to CT and enjoy your new sales position

 

[Mellow]

After being self-employed for 30+ years, I'd have a hard time being an employee. Besides. it's too cold up there. We had a cold front come through today; it was 75*.

 

[SeanKroll]

That's sounding more like it, imo, for the rods. If you are getting $600+ for a cable, well how bout come to CT and enjoy your new sales position

the custy can always say No Thanks to a profitable price.

 

[brendonv]

Even typing "4' drill bit" makes me think, yeah, nah, its not going to happen via me. Call Bartlett, they won't bat an eye about pruning this tree, add another cable, install 2 bolts $2500.00

My life got better when i stopped worrying about every job, even tho your capable. Its easier to refer someone else more properly equiped and willing to take the risk.

 

[flushcut]

300 hundo is good for the cable but $150 for all that drilling and screwing and etc etc? Cant your average cable be put in far faster and probably a bit cheaper on materials than a big ass rod?

Considering we can do a cable in less than an hour and a single rod in about half an hour. It's good money and it is what the market will bear in the area. Besides it doesn't take all that long to drill 40" of wood.

 

[cory]

Thanks for all the good responses!

 

[cory]

Besides. it's too cold up there. We had a cold front come through today; it was 75*.

You might have a point there- I haven't taken my long johns off yet this year.