Wood Turning

[NickfromWI]

...Do you finish them wet and let them warp, Nick?

I do indeed. Once done, I put them in a brown paper bag, often times with shavings to help slow the drying process. I weigh the bowl (to the milligram) weekly and write the weight on the bag.

When the bowl FEELS dry, I take it out of the bag and put it up on a shelf. Eventually you see the weight loss taper off meaning it's pretty much dry. At that point I finish any sanding and apply a finish (usually carnuba wax)

I LOVE seeing what the wood decides to do. It does sometimes mean the bowl is so distorted that I hate it. The fig bowl I made did that. I'll post a pic when I get home.

But sometimes it turns out AWESOME.


love
nick

 

[NickfromWI]

I took some pics of the bowl on the drying rack.



We will start with some that barely warped at all.

This juniper is still basically perfectly round.



This olive has barely warped a millimeter



This one is an ice cream bean tree. It has a neat yellow color. Not a speck of warping



This black acacia has a very mild warp. It's slightly oval, but if you look at the lip, it's taller on the sides than on the front and back





This flowering pear got wonky on me.



This is camphor and it just went every which way



This was guava. I know guava warps a lot, so for fun a made what I called a 90 degree bowl. The lip, the sides and the bottoms were all tight 90 degree angles. When done and still on the lathe you could put a square up to it and it was perfect. Now look at it





And I'll finish with the fig. I had read that it warps so much it wasn't worth dealing with. So I started with a tiny bowl and boy was it right....





So there you have it. I think it's some neat examples of the difference in warpability across different types of wood. Most of these bowls will be finished and still make nice bowls. That fig will .... Serve as an example of why not to turn fig?


love
nick

 

[rumination]

Cool stuff Nick!

 

[flushcut]

 

[vharrison]

Nick, have you ever worked with Norfolk Island Pine? Beautiful wood to turn.

 

[NickfromWI]

Not yet. We rarely prune them, much less removals. I'll keep my eyes peeled though!


love
nick

 

[stig]

I'm a control freak, so i don't want stuff to warp unless I can make it warp the exact way I wish it to.

So I rough turn, dry and finish turn everything.

 

[vharrison]

Not yet. We rarely prune them, much less removals. I'll keep my eyes peeled though!


love
nick

I can send you a piece next time we remove one. It is beautiful when turned.

 

[NickfromWI]

Cool!!!


love
nick

 

[CurSedVoyce]

You do any mulberry yet Nick? There should be tons down there. I bet it is beautiful when turned ....

 

[Ax-Man]

I can say for sure I am on the eve of making my first bowl from some apple wood with my new to me 1442 Jet inboard ,outboard wood lathe. I finally found some time for myself to play with the lathe. I roughed out some blanks awhile back and just about killed my band saw finishing them so I wouldn't have so much roughing to do. I only got as far as rough shaping the bowl but I can see why you guys turn bowls . It sure is fun especially with some of my new tools that came with the lathe . I hope I don't screw it up.

I got the lathe from an elderly woman whose husband can no longer work with the lathe. She hired us too do some tree removal and trimming at her farm. She made me a good deal on it along with just about all the accessories to do bowl turning, tools like bowl gouges, face plates, a nice heavy duty self centering chuck from One Way in Canada ( Srtonghold model) . That is what her husband did with the lathe. She was glad to see it go to me because of my interest in wood otherwise it was going to be sold at auction.

Now for a few questions

How important is getting rid of the dreaded " pith " for turning these bowls. From what I have seen to be politically correct in eliminating this pith is to noodle a firewood length log in half . I have done this but to be honest there isn't a whole lot of wood left unless your doing some really big logs.

Next. what is a good food safe finish to put on these bowls?? So far I have come up with tung oil, shellac, and beeswax. I personally don't see any bowls I make as being used to serve food but more as decoration around the house but you never know I might sell a few and have no idea what they might be used for. Probaly jumping the gun on this part but it could happen.

I'll post a pic if I do a good job on this bowl. The wood is apple with spalting in it. It is a little on the soft side , this new to me lathe is a vast improvement over my old stuff when it comes to turning between centers , really bites down on the stock ,hope I don't split the piece.

 

[stig]

On a splitting prone wood like apple, not including the pith and the growth rings closest to it would be very important IMO.
Unless you are making very thin walled ( 2-3 mm.) bowls that can get rid of the stresses in the wood by distorting.

As for food safe finishes, any finish is basically food safe, once it has hardened up/cured. That means it shouldn't smell any more.
There was a great article in "American woodturner" some years back by a chemist, who tested finishes.
He asked one of the companies, that produce so called "food safe" finishes, why they labelled their products that way, when they were no more food safe than anything else on the market ( that means 100%). The answer was: because it sells well.

I use Danish oil types mostly, since I prefer a mellow shine and they are easy to work with, once you learn how.

An easy way to finish a bowl is to mix beeswax and a hardening oil, such as walnut oil. Just touch a lump of beeswx to the spinning bowl, then apply a rag wet with oil, afterwards. The friction heat will melt the wax and mix it with the oil, for a nice finish.

I have a madrone burl bowl that I bought from Dale Larson in Oregon after taking a class with him. Itis finished that way and has been sitting around since 2005 without refinishing, but still looks fine.

Danish oil is more dish washing proof, which is why I use it.

 

[woodworkingboy]

Larry, some finishing oils have a drier in them to accelerate hardening time. Tung oil for example, without the drier, is a "hardening oil", so the 100% without the drier will harden, but the type that is sold with a drier in it, sets up quicker. Less time required between applications if you are doing more than once. If it says contains petroleum distillate on the label, I think that means the drier. Maybe you can find a product called Jasco Old Fashioned Tung Oil. It has a drier in it and is easy to use, gives good results. You can thin it with mineral spirits or turpentine for better penetration, but slower to build up a finish that way. The first application thinned and the following not so, is a good way to do it. Deeper penetration can bring out more color and add strength. Some finishing oils seem to better bring out the color of the wood, but results can end up looking quite similar.... degrees of shine can vary.

 

[NickfromWI]

I have and love this. I am always experimenting with finishes because- well ....I know jack squat about them. What I know is that I keep coming back to this

http://m.woodcraft.com/product/2002036/3729/beall-wood-buff-system.aspx

There's a ton of YouTube vids on it.


love
nick

 

[stig]

Too shiny and slow for my taste.

 

[woodworkingboy]

Wood polishing steel wool is good for giving wood a final buff up, and does an especially nice job on end grain. Quite a useful product for smoothing edges after rounding them over. I use the finest grit, #0000. Using wet and dry sandpaper when applying oil also well polishes the wood up. The best results with finishing are generally found when the wood has been brought up to a nice polish before the finish is applied.

 

[stig]

Watch out with leaving that steel wool around grinders. A flying spark will set it off, and it burns HOT and fast.

That is what I use for the final finish, too.

 

[Ax-Man]

The computer is working good today and have a little time on my hands so I thought I would get caught up on this thread.

Thanks for the recent replies they have been helpful. I have made three bowls since the my last post , two using just face plates and the third with my new to me chuck after the long awaited missing chuck key finally came from OneWay in Canada. I'll some pics when they are all done. I have been playing around with different finishes on them and sanding them more than other pieces I have done on the lathe.

These are just my thoughts about about some finishes from my limited experience. Oil based finishes like tung oil, boiled linseed oil either straight or thinned with mineral spirits bring out grain patterns but tend to darken wood. This can be good or bad depending on what you want to see. I also don't see much difference between one or the other after they dry. When you read the labels on the cans I think the adjectives used are just to get you to buy one product over the other. Shellac is nice it can go either way as a base or top coat, doesn't seem to darken wood like the oil based finishes and gives a good finish. Urathanes and spar varnish are nice for top coats if you like a real shiny look . They can darken wood also if used as a base and top coat . Shellac or sanding sealer as a base coat followed with the poly's or spar varnish makes a nice finish. Some poly's aren't recommended as a top coat over shellac. I have no clue as to why.

Anyone ever do any blending of finishes?? I have tried it a little and so far I don't see much of a difference in doing this verses doing it one step at a time. I don't know maybe I am expecting too much out of these wood finishing products. I pick what I think are unique pieces in the rough , turn them, sand them and they look great on the lathe. I put the finish on hoping for eye opening grain patterns to emerge from the finish that brings out all the little details I see in the grain but fall short in my expectations.

Does it make a difference in the finish if you apply it while the piece is still on the lathe and spinning??? I haven't really done this much, I have just taken the turned pieces off the lathe and used a brush or spray to finish them. I have avoided this because of the mess it can make on the lathe and am too lazy to put down paper to keep the finish off the the lathe bed and motor.

Anyone use sanding sealer?? I am using it on the last bowl just to see if makes any difference in the finish outcome.

Before I forget, while making these bowl blanks some of them still had the bark on the outside. I am not into natural edge bowls yet and didn't want any bark on them to save time and effort during the roughing process. A air hammer/air chisel works good for this. Knocks that bark right off with very little effort. The air chisel also worked good taking the bark off some small logs I have stored for making more ornamental type stuff. It beats using hand tools and hopefully will be a little safer when using the roughing gouge.

 

[stig]

Which oneway chuck did you get?

Personally I avoid lacqur finishes/ varnishes like the plaque for turned stuff, except for very small items like bottlestoppers.
For those I use a friction polish ( Mainly shellac based) that is applied on a slow running lathe and then polished/dried by higher RPMs, using the friction heat to dry it ( hence the name!)
That means I can finish the item in one process, which for me is important for a low price item.

I've worked my way through probably most of the finishes known to man over the last couple of decades.
Today I only use danish oil for bowls, which is a hardening mixture of different oils.
For the first application I thin it with about 20 of whatever thinner I have handy and apply it to the spinning object on the lathe ( Cut a thin piece of plywood that'll cover your rails and keep that next to the lathe, it is an easy to grab cover).
By then I'll have finished the bowl to somewhere between 400 and 600 grit depending on it's intended use, so I apply the oil with 0000 steel wool ( Equals 1000 grit).
Then I wipe the bowl of thoroughly and set it aside for a couple of weeks to harden.Back on the lathe, and run steel wool over it while it spins ( Slowly) to cut any raised fibers.
Another application of undiluted danish oil, wipe off and it is done.
I may give it one or two more turns with the steelwool+ oil if it is an exhibition type bowl, but for run of the mill salad bowls twice will do.

 

[Ax-Man]

Thanks Stig, I like your approach to finishing a bowl. Finding some of the things you have mentioned is a little hard to find. Our local stores don't exactly cater to wood turners. They have some things but not a big selection either.

The chuck is the Stong Hold model. I have only used it once but I like it and feel much safer than the other POS chuck I got

 

[woodworkingboy]

I don't know that oil finishes much darken the wood more that it will do on it's own over time. It initially does darken, but as wood ambers or what a particular species does over time, that darkening becomes less a factor, if any at all. Differences between oils can be hard to see without experience and time, but durability and moisture protection can vary

I have not mixed finishes, but recently to bring out a shine quickly and to possibly add some moisture protection, i have added a small amount of urethane to my usual oil finish, which is Perilla oil. Normally i don't have any use for a coating type pladticky like finish like urethane, but a small amount mixed with the oil is ok. I don't know if all oils will mix with urethane, but Perilla, which is an excellent finish on it's own, does. I also ad some mineral spirits to the mix to help blend it all together. It occurs that the urethane, be it a small amount, has some type of drying agent in it, which also acts to harden the oil in the mix faster than it would if used alone.

 

[Tucker943]

I feel stupid. I usually spray crap with Rust Oleum.

 

[woodworkingboy]

LOL. I have uses for Rust-Oleum too, but can't buy it here. We've gotten to importing WD-40 though.

 

[Ax-Man]

Stig's recent reply got me motivated as I was close to finishing my three bowl project.

Here are the pic's. Each bowl has it's own story so I'll try not to drag this out. I downloaded the pic's first so I hope I get the order right for each bowl. At times I thought I was making small pots instead of bowls

Bowl #1 is made from Apple with some spaulting in it or maybe a better way to describe it some rotting. Apple is pretty wood but like Stig mentioned it can be a pain to turn. It can split,pieces break off if your too rough with the tools this piece was no exception so I quit while I was ahead but it still didn't turn out like I wanted it to. It would have turned out better if I sanded more like I did the other two. Apple will split within hours after you turn it. You have to get on it quick with sealers to keep it from checking too bad. this piece was finished with two coats of Tung oil with a top coat of Shellac to give it some shine.

Bowl #2 is some spaulted Maple. I have always liked the look of spaulted Maple but it too is very difficult to work with. I wanted to try U-Tubes Captain Eddie's "Shine Juice" as a finish but screwed up mixing it the first time . I dumped brush cleaner in the mix instead of mineral spirits, that bowl looked awful which meant resanding the whole bowl along with using some sanding sealer as I resanded it. I don't know if made a big difference or not. I got the "Shine Juice" right the second time and used Stig's method to apply it on the lathe. I liked the way this bowl turned out. It has the look I was looking for along with a nice shine and a really nice smooth feel when you touch it. The other two bowls have a some what rough feel because I didn't apply the finish on the lathe even though I sanded them on the lathe.

Bowl # 3 is Cherry, the goal on this one was to use the chuck and finish it with no tell tale signs it was ever on a lathe. I did accomplish that goal but it was a trial and error process. The bowl was suppose to be bigger and was going good but I didn't get rid of all the pith and splits were showing up and during the hollowing process I got a catch with the bowl gouge and really made a couple of deep gouge marks in it. I had to reduce the overall size of the bowl to get rid of these marks. The darn thing still has some small checks in it even after putting the finish on it. The finish is two coats of that shine juice only applied with a brush on the first coat and a shop towel for the second coat. I am not impressed at all with the way it came out . If I had applied it on the lathe like the maple bowl it might have turned out different.

I have just about about given up on Cherry wood for the lathe. I like the color but it splits worse than apple, the grain isn't all that great either. I have made boards out of Cherry logs that look really good and have stayed stable during the drying process with very few checks and minimal warping. I don't know I guess it all depends on individual pieces of wood.

I could go on and on with this bowl making experience but will end it here. These bowls were a first attempt and a good learning experience for doing future bowls.

In case anyone wants to know what " Shine Juice " is it is nothing more than 1/3 Shellac 1/3 boiled linseed oil 1/3 denatured alcohol. I used mineral spirits instead of alcohol. I was going to be daring like Jay and add some urathane to it but didn't.

 

[woodworkingboy]

I like the spalted wood bowl! Nice warm shape to it and it looks good for peanuts!