vertical cracks/checking = knowing when to say when?

[Spellfeller]

Jeff, I never had anything particularly undesirable happen when using my Maasdam, only that I did note the potential for something to occur after first using it because it won't hold the line if for some reason tension is released.

That WOULD stink if the tree went over backwards due to some freak (and dramatic) release of tension. Though in practice, I'm not sure I've seen the potential for this--OTOH I certainly could be denser than usual! I've had hundreds of pounds go out of the line as wood fibers break, i.e., there was suddenly LOTS of slack to take up that hadn't been there before, but the rope never gave signs that it would run loose on me in the wrong direction. Do the pawls actually release somehow? ::eek!::

One device that won't slip is a Tirfor fixed line puller (griphoist). http://www.tractel.com/us/series.php?id_serie=47

These look very cool, Jay. I checked out their site a few days ago (maybe because I saw you reference them elsewhere?). Looks well made and durable, and as a 160# weakling, I like the longer handle for more leverage!

 

[Marc-Antoine]

I can't see how the rope could slip in the drum with a sudden slack. When the rope is hold tight with max load, it's stretched and encrusted between the both half drums. The rope doesn't go out easily, even slacked. During the pulling, a steel finger has to take it out of the drum.

Actually, my rope puller slipped once, a few inches, because I didn't sat the rope properly in the drum at first.

You should consider this too : http://www.tractel.com/us/series.php?id_serie=52
It's a simplified version of the Tirefor, one handle and no case but same action. The release isn't as easy though. It uses any usual cable or wire and it works amazingly well directly on a rigging line. I purchased one recently as a pretensioning / lifting device for the porty. I used it only once (yet) to pull a back leaner poplar, 2:1 MA and a redirect, easily set with the 5/8" line.

Thanks, Willie. Is that to say--with all other variables being equal--that vertical cracks are less concerning?

Yes, but not to say the vertical split doesn't matter though. With a vertical crack, it's like you have 2 pieces of wood side by side, full length. Each of them could theoretically (best case) stand there by itself. You can work on it.
With a horizontal crack, you have almost 2 logs, one over the other, as if you cut it before half way. Actually, that means that the wood is severely compromised, all punky. You can't trust this part at all.

 

[Grendel]

I think there will be three more coming down on Thursday Griff, if so I'll document.

Cheers

 

[sotc]

Thanks, Willie. Is that to say--with all other variables being equal--that vertical cracks are less concerning?

Generally speaking, yes.

 

[Spellfeller]

Thanks, peeps. My education on cracks continues!

Last night I used my new BigShot to set the pull line for my old Maasdam Pow'r-Puller. I made good progress, taking out a bunch of 4"-6" limbs. In the process, I got one of my throw bags stuck and made one last pull to try to get it down. It was late and light was fading. Of course it was proving to be incredibly difficult--by far the most difficult of the day. I was putting all 160# of my manly bulk into each pull and advancing the wheel one notch at a time. Finally, I told myself that if I didn't hear cracking in five more pulls, I would leave the throw bag (and now the 3-strand) in the tree. Sure enough I heard cracking, and then more, and then LOTS, and then the whole top came out with a mighty crash and slammed into the ground.

Here's a video of the aftermath (My Embed Fu is strong!)

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/E5zwhJciy-E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[Spellfeller]

In this one, I draw a distinction between "live" vs. "dead."

To be clear NONE of the top that came out was alive. A better distinction would have been "hard & dead" vs. "more like styrofoam & dead."

(Apologies for the audio that retells the story I told above!)

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/lqlilNohqoU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[Spellfeller]

Last vid for now, here is a fungus that one of the consulting arborists pointed out. (I said "spider-webby," but it may look more "spider leggy"!)

I'll bet you guys can ID it!

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/YNDZrgCe8NY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Lets just say, that if you can break that much top out of it... you should not climb it

I have not had my Maasdam slip either. Unless I did not tension it enough to start. Now if it is something you are going to worry about working solo.. Set a porty right under it and capture the tail of the line in it. Of course I set mine up diffy. I pull on another line I have set with a short piece of 3 strand through the Maasdam using a prussic to attach it to my pull line. I use about 40 feet through the puller that way. Then you can capture the tail of the actual pull line into a porty. CLear as mud?

 

[woodworkingboy]

Stephen, do you sometimes reset the tail of the pull line on the party tight, or just keep it as it is from the beginning as a holding line if something should go south?

 

[CurSedVoyce]

I reset as needed.
Like put tension on the line. Capture the line on the porty.. walk back and cut.. More pull needed? Add more pull, capture line... Walk back and cut... rinse and repeat as necessary. rare I have to set it more than twice. Often just once.

 

[Eric H-L]

vertical cracks/checking = knowing when to say when?

"I was their neighbor until just a few months ago, Butch.



It's REALLY dangerous to the bank account when you can drop by on your way home from work!! "

Jeff,
I wish we had met met when you were still in Indianapolis. I am also a non-pro who struggles with working too close to Treestuff. I have talked with Phil about getting my paycheck direct deposited to Treestuff.
Eric




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Spellfeller]

Hey, Eric! Sorry I missed you! I sure miss my proximity to TS. Phil is the funniest counterman character I've run into in a long time. I think Nick Offerman should play him in the Story of TreeStuff movie...

Welcome to The House!

 

[Spellfeller]

Lets just say, that if you can break that much top out of it... you should not climb it

Not even 1) now that it's significantly shorter and 2) on the TIP in the neighboring live tree?

I have not had my Maasdam slip either. Unless I did not tension it enough to start. Now if it is something you are going to worry about working solo.. Set a porty right under it and capture the tail of the line in it. Of course I set mine up diffy. I pull on another line I have set with a short piece of 3 strand through the Maasdam using a prussic to attach it to my pull line. I use about 40 feet through the puller that way. Then you can capture the tail of the actual pull line into a porty. CLear as mud?

I actually understand this, Stephen! Is that a bad sign?

Cool system.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

You could climb the remainder if you strap/bind the codoms.
Prior to breaking is what I refer. Not only can stuff break away or under you, but a top can break off from above you just by shaking a bad tree like that gaffing it. Shit falling on your head will kill you as easily as a fall. No matter your tie in.

 

[Spellfeller]

Got it. Thanks, Stephen.

I could have weakened the union further when I pulled out the top. I'll see what I can find locally in the HD strap department (Tractor Supply, etc.); I'm surprised that TreeStuff only seems to carry straps specific to the Stein bollards?

 

[Spellfeller]

Spell, you can attach some weight mid-line to maintain tension as well. I've been using rounds of whatever wood is available on site. . .

Thanks, Sam! I've read about this/seen pix, but never done it.

I might try it on a smaller healthier tree first, before I added another variable to this job--which is already out on the bleeding edge of my comfort zone!

 

[woodworkingboy]

I've used a lever chain hoist to pull together codoms or bind a trunk. Jeff, I don't know if you are hauling loads, but a chain hoist is also great for cinching down. Great power from such a little thing. If you don't want to invest in one, probably a rental yard can provide one for cheap per day. Before owning one, I remember wanting to rent one years ago to move some machinery. Met a nice guy at a rental place who loaned me one of theirs for nothing, some straps too Never forgot that...

 

[Spellfeller]

Great suggestion, Jay! Thanks!

 

[Marc-Antoine]

... Not only can stuff break away or under you, but a top can break off from above you just by shaking a bad tree like that gaffing it. Shit falling on your head will kill you as easily as a fall. No matter your tie in.

I'm glad you worded that this way. I already knew what it's implied in such a bad tree, but now it's put in a better place in my mind. Like an eye opener thing...

 

[woodworkingboy]

To emphasize Stephen's caution, a fellow here was cutting below a union on a Zelkova, only had one of the leads tied off to a crane. When lifting away the union broke apart. Very sadly the climber died in the tree.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Often I can just bind the tree with a couple 10000 lb rated straps from tractor supply. Ratchet straps.

 

[Spellfeller]

Just to close the loop for posterity's sake, this thread evolved HERE for advice on binders.

Successful conclusion to the saga--with, thankfully, zero damage to people or property--is HERE.