Tree Work in Detroit? (or other hard-hit cities)

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  • #26
Liberal America because of all the monies that Libs have given towards programs in Detroit, only to have it wasted by officials both in the public and private sector.

Like you said Kevin, Detroit workers (many union and non-union) expect "fair" pay to push buttons that robots can do. They lack skill and many lack motivation.

I don't know the answer, but I do know that America needs to study the decline of Detroit a lot closer, before we end up busted and bankrupt just like them. Only time will tell, if Detroit will recover, I sure hope that it does.
 
It really doesn't take very many people to make things anymore. that is a key issue here and often forgotten in the discussions of detroit. Making stuff in lights out factories doesn't create many jobs. Lights out because the robots don't need to see anything. There is an old alcoholic who comes by asking for bottles periodically. he worked for many years in the rouge plant shoveling coal to heat the furnaces. You know that is a job that is not necessary anymore.
 
chris_girard said:
Liberal America because of all the monies that Libs have given towards programs in Detroit, only to have it wasted by officials both in the public and private sector.

Like you said Kevin, Detroit workers (many union and non-union) expect "fair" pay to push buttons that robots can do. They lack skill and many lack motivation.

I don't know the answer, but I do know that America needs to study the decline of Detroit a lot closer, before we end up busted and bankrupt just like them. Only time will tell, if Detroit will recover, I sure hope that it does.
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There has been a lot of corruption that is for sure. There is no disputing that. That cuts both ways though. The city just gave away a huge plot in the middle of downtown to build a hockey arena . Tax payers expense... Crony capitalism at its worst. I don't know if those guys qualify as Libs. or just opportunists.
 
Lights out manufacturing, that's a new one on me.

Is Detroit solvent after the 2013 bankruptcy? I was surprised to see the population is only 700k.
 
Supposedly, I doubt it. there are still a lot of issues with pensions being paid etc. I haven't actually heard anything about it in a while though.
 
There is millions of tons of stuff made every day that is not done by robots.

But it is hard work. It does you no good to wish for something that is not in demand. To imagine the twisted, rusted hulk of Detroit as a phoenix rising from the ashes on the backs of service jobs and liberal arts degrees is not very attainable in my opinion.
 
to that I would agree. Detroit still makes more stuff than the rest of y'all and has been more or less steady in output for a while, but still losing jobs. The wars in afghanistan and Irag have helped a lot keep things cranking. There is a shop pretty close to my house Milton Manufacturing that pounds out armor for humvees and military vehicles. But while they are expanding production, they are not really hiring more people.
 
The shop I mentioned in Great Falls makes things like bride sections, building sections, oil field equipment and so forth. I am sure some of it is automated, but they must employ humans. Welders, engineers, machinists, etc.

Good, honest jobs.
 
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  • #38
Thanks for posting the article Kevin. I will have to read it tonight, as I'm actually leaving in a few minutes to go climb in the city today. Should be a warmer day than yesterday.

I'm glad that you mentioned kids, as there is no doubt that they will play a huge role in Detroit's future recovery. I watched another good documentary on the Detroit school system hosted by Dan Rather. Here it is below;

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Thanks for posting the Dan Rather documentary. It seems an impossible situation in the public schools....no accountability, combined with mismanagement and fraud. Without having the people in charge of the school board whose primary interest is in seeing a decent education provided, there seems little hope. Around half the adults living in Detroit being functionally illiterate, is indeed something that points to a very serious problem that has gone on for way too long and is to the point of being unsolvable. A billion dollar budget for Detroit public schools at the time of the documentary, and the thing shrouded in mismanagement. Mismanagement seems too good a word really, it's more like chaos.
 
kevin bingham said:
https://news.vice.com/story/school-choice-detroit-betsy-devos

its kind of a long article but it gets to the heart of the biggest issue I see in Detroit and why I have little hope for a comeback anytime soon with dumber and dumber kids coming up in the world. I have no idea what I am going to do with my kids. The idea of neighborhood schools is a thing of the past.
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gotta love The Treehouse, no way in hell I would have read that article had it not been part of this discussion. I read 70% and skimmed the rest. I have a much better handle on those issues now but I have a basic question still- why do charter schools receive public funding?? I get it that if peeps start a private school, good for them, they are on their own. And public schools, I get that. But why publicly fund a charter school which competes with and tends to hurt the public school system?
 
Kevin, I (we) have been digging your perspectives on life in Detroit, it sounds like you have a good niche for you and your biz. But if the schooling issue for your kids is potentially a major problem, would you relocate out of town for the sake of good schools? Or maybe you have a good idea re good schools near you, which in Detroit are obviously rare, but perhaps do exist.

Just curious, thanks.
 
because you can have for profit companies makeing money. there are a lot of people that beleive that if noone is making a profit, than its a waste. same as private prisons or private trash disposal. everything should be operated privately nd their should be competition. You can also avoid teachers unions. find kids right out of college, pay them in experience, increase the bottom line. the government pays the school per pupil. the more kids you can draw to the school the less you can pay the teachers, the better the better the bottom lne.
 
Yes I get that, that's where private schools do their thing. But charters seem to be sorta private but getting public funds... it doesn't make sense or am I dense.
 
If they revamped the public school system using money that was going toward charters, then why couldnt they "fix" the public schools? Not to mention the fact that the article says the charters are generally not much better than public schools.
 
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  • #45
Great article Kevin. I too can't understand why so many states are going with charter schools, unless they see a way that it'll save them money?

Kevin, if I lived in the Detroit area and had young kids that needed to go to school, I would really see if there was a way to home school them instead of sending them to public schools. I know that this is very hard with most people needing both parents to work, just to make ends meet.
 
as for schools, we have 2 years to figure it out. there are some good schools out there, maybe even one of yhe better charters. it can be done. none of them are close though. its possible we move for that reason. 2 years goes by fast. some of the suburban public schools have open enrollment. who knows. ill keep yall posted.

the lack of schools is why one can by a 2000 square foot home in good condition for 25,000 and 6000 square foot commercial building for 50,000. It would be annoying to move and have to deal with a mortgage. but maybe not as annoying as traveling across town to drop off and pick up the kids everyday.
 
we have thought about home schooling. but that is a huge amount of work. im not so much worried about academics as we can provide that. i would like my kids to have a social environment that is stable and helps them learn to be decent people and not weirdos. We have talked about home schooling though. its a possibility.
 
The social problem is a big one with homeschooling, it can be overcome though. I think it'd be fun.
 
Levi said:
The social problem is a big one with homeschooling, it can be overcome though. I think it'd be fun.
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or a huge amount of work and exhausting. Its hard to come up with different things to do. it also means that one of us would have to work extra hard so the other would not have to work at all.
 
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