TIG welding for dummies

[sawinredneck]

I have a buddy, never welded before in his life but generally a quick study, his dream is to build a motorcycle from the ground up, frame and all. I'm sure we can figure it all out with enough time, but I've never run a tig before in my life and he is insitant thats how he wants it welded.
We are looking into the Harbor frieght tig package, $399.99 (I'll provide a link in a bit) for a possible purchase as there will be no real hurry in getting this done it should be sufficient. He doesn't have a garage, so it will be "left" here for me to use as well.
Long story that I will try not to get out of hand, any tips on what to look for in a tig and how to use one properly?

Link:http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=98233

 

[woodworkingboy]

Get one that can do both aluminum and stainless/mild steel, switch between AC and DC. Inverter type is recommended, and if for long cycle use, a water cooled torch is cool. Pulse welding ability is good to, for thin material.

I think Carl had a thread about tig, maybe part of another thread.

I recommend taking a course if one is available in the area, that is what I did from Panasonic, who made my welder, and also offers a two day course for the basics. There are some things like what tungsten electrode size to use, and appropriate cone size to direct argon flow......proper settings for up slope and down slope cycles. Good to be clear on it as you move up the learning curve.

Not sure if tig would be the best choice for a bike frame? Welds are clean though, no slag.

 

[stehansen]

I did a little TIG welding in college and it seemed very similar to torch welding.

 

[gf beranek]

I'd shy away from those Harbor Fright machines. A buddy of my bought one and it was a piece of junk. You could get a better deal for the bucks on a used machine from someone that upgraded.

Even used it may cost a little bit more, but you can always get your money back later. Get a Miller. You can't go wrong.

 

[Al Smith]

A good well maintained used Lincoln ,Miller or Hobart will be a better deal than that harbor frieght oriental third world junk .

Don't be welding together a motorcycle frame until you get darned good at it .The only way to get good is to do it .

 

[woodworkingboy]

A good welder can last a lifetime.

 

[RIVERRAT]

Harbor Freight welders Suck!!!!!
Cheap way to practice TIG when you haven't purchased the TIG machine is with gas. The hand motion & heat control principles are very close.

Plus a gas system is cheap & something any one working anything made of steel should have.

 

[DTW902]

Stay away from the Harbor Freight stuff Andy. Look around you should be able to pick up a decent basic tig set up. At a resonable price. Look for a AC/DC machine so you can do all metals.

 

[DTW902]

Andy.

http://wichita.craigslist.org/tls/1385439832.html

http://wichita.craigslist.org/tls/1349880938.html

 

[sawinredneck]

He's footing the bill, so it's his call one way or the other. He started out wanting to do it in alum. and I had to talk him out of that because of costs, impurities and lack of knowledge!
He's watched all of these biker build off shows etc. and thinks TIG is the only way to get a decent weld. I'm trying like hell to talk him into a decent MIG instead, much easier to use, cheaper and I trust the welds more.

 

[cybergeek23851]

If you must go with an "import," avoid the units that utilize MOSFET technology. Their reliability is short lived, go with with a IGBT based unit.

Otherwise, I also have to tip my to Thermal arc as well as Miller for their "Diversion", as well as Hobart for their "Tigmate"

The "cheapest" tig that I would go with
http://cgi.ebay.com/THERMAL-ARC-95S...temQQimsxZ20090817?IMSfp=TL090817177007r26943

http://www.toolking.com/category/welding/welding-machines/tig-welders.aspx

http://www.weldingsuppliesfromioc.com/servlet/the-3391/MILLER-DIVERSION-165-AC-fdsh-DC/Detail

 

[cybergeek23851]

I'm trying like hell to talk him into a decent MIG instead, much easier to use, cheaper and I trust the welds more.

The Hobart Handler 140 is a great machine. I love mine. It will easily handle .030 and .024 in doing Mig. I haven't tried .035 seeing as I'm currently using it on thin sheet metal and tube(motorcycle gas tank and frame for a paying friend). If you need more... I recommend the Handler 187 or 210 with spool gun option for stainless or aluminum wire.

http://www.toolking.com/hobartwelders_500500a.aspx

http://www.toolking.com/hobartwelders_500525.aspx

http://www.toolking.com/Hobart_500526.aspx

 

[RIVERRAT]

I am going to say he will become frustrated with a TIG machine before he ever is able to lay a good weld bead.
If he buys the cheapest or most affordable machine from any manufacture he will become frustrated.
If he has the gumption to learn he should start with gas. If he cant learn to gas weld no since spending the money on a TIG machine

 

[sawinredneck]

Thanks Jason, I've yet to figure out why the 187 is more, but whatever I really want the Miller 140, but that's what I want not him.

I suggest we play with Oxy setup tommorow afternoon Jeff, he looked at me funny until I showed him a couple of videos on tig welding. "Oh, so it's like gas just using electricity?" He's getting it. I also had a time explaining to him why having a foot control was advantageous, which the HF model does not have.

 

[RIVERRAT]

A foot control is a need to have item. You dont have to manipulate the torch as much.

 

[cybergeek23851]

Thanks Jason, I've yet to figure out why the 187 is more, but whatever I really want the Miller 140

I meant in a more power sense. The HH140 is literally a rebadged Miller, without the dang price tag It uses Miller parts and accessories in a gray case. I don't really like the new autoset feature found on the new small Miilermatic welders.

 

[sawinredneck]

I wasn't thinking, I thought it was the 200, I was at Atwoods today and the 187 was like $200 more than the 200.

 

[cybergeek23851]

A foot control is a need to have item. You dont have to manipulate the torch as much.

I also like flex heads too for tube work. oN another note, water cooled is nice for plate and bench fabbing but it gets bulky working in tight quarters.

 

[RIVERRAT]

I also like flex heads too for tube work. oN another note, water cooled is nice for plate and bench fabbing but it gets bulky working in tight quarters.

I have never used a water cooled torch. Not for sure if I have evr seen one.

 

[cybergeek23851]

I have never used a water cooled torch. Not for sure if I have evr seen one.

Water-cooled flex torch:
http://www.weldcraft.com/products/wp-series/wp-25/

http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php?t=27283

 

[sotc]

I'd walk away if he buys harbor freight, there is a difference. He will get mad and give up his whole project through frusteration

 

[Dave Shepard]

I'd look around for a used one as well. I bought my Lincoln Tombstone for $25, and my Miller TIG for $100. I have the foot control and a water cooled torch.

TIG is not the only way to get good welds. There are a lot of airplanes flying around that were gas-welded before TIG was commonplace. In fact gas welding has a self-annealing (or was it heat treating?) process that isn't available with other welding processes.

 

[olyman]

tig keeps the heat in a very small area, hence more strength. unless of course you sit in one spot forever!!~~~~!! mig tends to make the heat transfer to a larger area--like a oxacetylene gas torch--most ALL drag race frames are tig welded, esp if they are high moly--

 

[woodworkingboy]

The cool thing about tig is that you can weld without adding a filler metal, where such application applies. I've had some problems on mild steel, where the steel wants to bubble, never that with stainless. Not sure what the problem was, unless corrupted by too much heat?