How to Grind Stumps successfully?

[rfwoody]

What do you have to know to grind stumps for homeowners?

It must not be rocket science because a neighbor down the street (an intelligent and mechanically minded guy) rented a stump grinder from home depot and ground some 24" stumps and you wouldn't know there had ever been a tree there.

I know about the issue that the homeowner is responsible for knowing where buried wires, pipes, etc. are.

But can y'all help me out with these sorts of questions.....or anything else you can think of?

* Does the it throw rocks and debris that could break a window or cause damage to cars, etc.?
* Do you need to have a shield around it to keep rocks, debris, dirt, etc. contained?
* How deep does one normally grind the stump?
-- I saw one work description where the guy said he ground stump and all roots to grade level -- is this good enough or does one normally go lower?
* Does the job normally include filling any remaining holes or depressions with dirt, mulch, sod, etc.? -- i.e. so the lawn is all nice and level ...... or is the ground up stump debris good enough to rake into the hole?

I have bid a job to remove 6 Bradford Pears and they want me to include on the bid, grinding the 6 stumps.

The stumps will average around 16" so I am thinking of charging 6 x $100 (= $600 total) using a rented home depot stump grinder --- does that sound reasonable or should I charge more?

Thanks!

 

[Mick!]

For many of your questions the answers is ‘depends’

Yes it can throw rocks, a screen can be used, but for me good skirts on the machine often are enough, only cars and windows get protection from me.


How deep? Is there going to be a building there or fishpond etc? If so you have to be pretty thorough and regrind deeper and deeper.
If it’s just a corner of the garden that’ll be grassed over you can be less strict, a few inches down is often enough.

A big stump will not leave a hole but a great big pile of grindings, which you’ll need to ascertain if you’re going to remove them or leave them in a pile. Usually if you just leave it a little proud of the lawn level it’ll settle after a bit.

Tell them to throw a bag of compost on and seed it.

Pricing? Can’t help you.

 

[rfwoody]

Thanks Mick!

 

[Buddy]

I would charge more but you better get advice from someone that’s ground more than 5 stumps, it’s not my cup of tea.

 

[squisher]

I only had one grinder but it could fling the odd thing. Me or employees broke a window, a glass deck railing, and a car windshield. As well as ingested a chainlink fence. Oddly enough I fully owned up to everyone of the damages and never had to pay a cent for any single one of them. Weirdest luck.

Window the guy didn't care said he'd look after it. Deck railing was through a landscape company through a property management company. And despite the actual owner being there when it happened and my repeated, three strikes your out, attempts to pay for it. No bill was ever submitted. The windshield the lady was furious about, driving by while I was doing city sidewalk stumps! Brand new truck, brand new like fifty miles on it new. It was the tiniest chip but she was irate about it. Gave her all my info and her husband phoned me up a couple days later to let me know that it had been fixed for free under their insurance and thanked me for owning up to it and committing to looking after it. Lastly the frigging fence nightmare! I swear that grinder barely nicked that chainlink fence sucked a bunch of it in lickity split. Things came to a violent halt rapidly. Fellow told me the long term plan was to take the fence out anyways so not to worry about it.

Sometimes you're better lucky than good I guess. Ground a whole lot of stumps that were uneventful though. Decent enough money I guess for staring at a stump forever. I really really disliked grinding stumps. I just found it painfully boring. Sometimes there was a glimmer of enjoyment from completely obliterating any existence of a tree. A sadistic pleasure I guess of being fully equipped and capable to make a giant tree, poof, disappear!

 

[flushcut]

FYI it's not just the homeowners responsibility to know where the utilities are it's yours as well! You are the contractor your life may be in danger. Diggers hotline is free and easy a ticket # is you golden ticket into Wonka.

 

[Raj]

In my area if I call for a locate it will cost money, if the HO calls then it is free. About 50% of my jobs need a locate, IMO, some customers disagree. If something gets wrecked and no locate, it'll cost, a lot. If the locate is done, and they miss something, and it gets wrecked, it's a get out of jail free card. Some phone, data and cable lines are merely inches below around here.

I carry plastic sign boards, old blankets and sheets to cover things up.

No idea of the pricing, but I aim to get $100/half hour, but I don't tell custys that.

 

[rfwoody]

Thanks Shawn, sounds good!
Squisher, that is great about not having to pay for any of those things --- and it is revealing about what can happen. Man, that chain link fence getting wound up in the grinder... that must have taken a lot of time to get out.
Flushcut, good point! -- I will call the toll free number and also I plan to use my low-end (i.e. inexpensive) metal detector.

 

[rfwoody]

Thanks Peter. Good to know!

How long does it take on average to cut a fresh 16" stump that is 2" above ground?

 

[Raj]

This is my grinder.

https://youtu.be/k5WQDW2FkIs

 

[stig]

Thanks Peter. Good to know!

How long does it take on average to cut a fresh 16" stump that is 2" above ground?

Depends on the size of your grinder!

 

[Tree09]

Locates are free here in the us, and I'm completely shocked they aren't free everywhere. If that's the case just give them your name, don't say you are a business unless they ask. Locates are also required by law, even if you are in the middle of a cornfield or something. Just call and have them mark it out, and go home at the end of the day. You would be amazed at what is run where.

 

[Mellow]

For one-off jobs like that, you're better off subbing it out. Charge the customer $600, give the stump guy $500 and you make $100 for making a phone call or two.

I sold my stump grinders years ago when I realized it was more cost effective to sub out that aspect of the job.

 

[SkwerI]

I agree with Brett. My stump guy has a $80K stump grinder that he pulls behind a $70K pickup truck (F350 4x4) and his rates start as low as $75 for a stump. On multiples at one job he's always more than fair. If I called him for those 6 stumps I would pay about $150-200, mostly depending on how much time he had to spend setting up. His grinder is so fast that grinding time is almost irrelevant until you get into 3' and bigger stumps.

Why would I waste my time fighting a tiny POS rental grinder in order to get those dollars? I make much better money on the tree removal. If you want to make money grinding stumps then the best way is to do it full time. The stump grinder isn't making you a dime unless it is working. Grinding a couple stumps per month will never pay for the cost of a machine, and renting a machine will mean you will end up working for free (money made off the stumps will barely cover rental fees).

Nope, the way to make money on stumps is to do a lot of them. If you grind 5-10 stumps per day at a minimum of $75 per stump and you can work 3-4 days per week at it, then you can generate enough cash flow to pay for the machine, cover expenses and make a decent living. Like any other business, it takes time to get good at it and it takes time to build your reputation and client base.

If you don't want to grind stumps for a living, then ask around and find somebody local who does. Then hire him to grind your stumps.

 

[SeanKroll]

Robert, if you aren't using the TreeHouse search engine, you should.

38 pages of stump grinding discussion on page two of the search results for "stump grinding".
https://www.masterblasterhome.com/s...ng-tips-tricks-tools&highlight=stump+grinding

 

[rfwoody]

This is my grinder.

https://youtu.be/k5WQDW2FkIs

Thanks Peter. A picture is worth 1000 words as they say.

For an older guy, that video to me says it all, with all very much respect to those much more experienced in tree work and smarter in business than me.

What was the condition/type of that 16" stump?
How would it compare do you think to a fresh Bradford Pear stump the same size?

 

[rfwoody]

Good point, Stig. Peter's video helped put some context on things.
Yeah, Kyle, I'm in the U.S. so maybe it will be free, but if not I'll ask the owners to make the call.
Yeah, Mellow, that would be ideal, but my insurance doesn't allow me to sub out work --- I can provide a list of phone numbers to the customer though.

 

[rfwoody]

Yeah, Brian, you describe an ideal and smart sounding business setup on both sides -- you and your stump grinding contractor.
My insurance won't let me sub out work, and this particular job might be a good leaning experience to push the envelope a little since I've never ground a stump before so I'll have some experience to better evaluate from, even though in the long run it might not be ideal.

 

[flushcut]

Thanks Shawn, sounds good!
Squisher, that is great about not having to pay for any of those things --- and it is revealing about what can happen. Man, that chain link fence getting wound up in the grinder... that must have taken a lot of time to get out.
Flushcut, good point! -- I will call the toll free number and also I plan to use my low-end (i.e. inexpensive) metal detector.

Welcome! A soil probe is good to have, a shovel, and a big pry/demo bar is a good addition to the truck also.
There is a catalog called Ben Meadows that sells the very same detectors that the utilities use to locate things. There maybe other sources but they are the only one I know of.

 

[rfwoody]

Robert, if you aren't using the TreeHouse search engine, you should.

38 pages of stump grinding discussion on page two of the search results for "stump grinding".
https://www.masterblasterhome.com/s...ng-tips-tricks-tools&highlight=stump+grinding

Yeah, Thanks Sean.

That was the first thing I did, was do the search -- and in fact your/that very post was the first one I started looking at

And I will go back and continue reading that thread and others ------ but I guess (possibly due to laziness) I figured I might save time by (re-re)-asking the question in my own words to get maybe some specific taylored info to my situation and also to separate the wheat from the chaff in the search through the goldmine of the MB archives (not much "chaff" you understand but after I did the search, as I recall, your's was the only thread (at least on the first page) that had the word "stump" in the title/heading) .... also, this way is like attacking the question from 2 sides -- personal and general .... even if I looked long enough I would certainly find everything I needed in the MB archives where all my concerns/questions have been addressed multiple times.

Anyway, thanks Sean, and All for your help and feedback!

 

[SeanKroll]

811 is the public utility locate, here.

No irrigation, septic, low voltage electrical lights. Just public utilities.

A cutter mattock and pick mattock are useful if you're in cobble-filled soils.


Digging around the stump a little bit at the bid can help you know what kind of soil/ rocks you'll deal with.
Locally, I can often tell if its going to be sand, glacial outwash with lots or river rocks, subdivision topsoil over native.
This plays into depth of grind.


Also, when people have buried their trees, killing them (like a new home's lot being leveled with fill), you can dig down enough for your powerhead and bar, and cut the trunk low enough below the soil line, sometimes. The stump will still be there, just way down. May want to wack off the bark at the cut.

 

[rfwoody]

Thanks Flushcut. I will check out Ben Meadows.
I've got a 5 or 6' heavy pointed bar I use to break up ground for digging post holes.

 

[rfwoody]

811 is the public utility locate, here.

No irrigation, septic, low voltage electrical lights. Just public utilities.

A cutter mattock and pick mattock are useful if you're in cobble-filled soils.


Digging around the stump a little bit at the bid can help you know what kind of soil/ rocks you'll deal with.
Locally, I can often tell if its going to be sand, glacial outwash with lots or river rocks, subdivision topsoil over native.
This plays into depth of grind.


Also, when people have buried their trees, killing them (like a new home's lot being leveled with fill), you can dig down enough for your powerhead and bar, and cut the trunk low enough below the soil line, sometimes. The stump will still be there, just way down. May want to wack off the bark at the cut.

Great ideas, Sean. Thanks.

Yeah, that was one particular lightbulb thing I picked up in that thread -- of digging/grinding around the edges of the stump so you can get below grade with the chainsaw bar and cut the top off the stump as low or lower than you would have ground it anyway.

 

[SeanKroll]

Noticed your new signature, Woody. Pulling levers on a stump grinder, no clean-up is well suited to an older person. A respirator (~$30) is SOOO worth it.

An umbrella on the grinder is in my future. If I have a big stump that I'm not subbing out, I'll use an EZ-up canopy.

 

[rfwoody]

Thanks Sean!
I think Brian's guy with the big/expensive/powerful truck and stump grinder is way out of my league, but watching Peter's video of him and his 10hp stump grinder makes me think I might be able to handle something like that.... at least give it a try.