Broken aluminum ring

  • Thread starter Tobe Sherrill
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the infamous hammer tested gold rings
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8-10year plain aluminum
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I dont want to throw the baby out with the bath water...ya know

better accountability with manafacutrers is in order
 
Brendon's ring shows a pretty classic tension/compression pattern with no inclusions or impurities. That was probably a good ring.

TIG welded steel is strong as hail.

I don't see the point of aluminum FS rings. Weight savings in an FS doesn't do much.
 
If your aluminum hardware EVER hits the ground, it is suspect. Aluminum rings in friction savers, and to a degree, aluminum carabiners, have a suspect trust in friction savers in the normal day to day use in treework from now on.
 
Leon,

The TreeStuff.com guy just mentioned on the Buzz that he'll be carrying the CT rings soon.
 
NickfromWI said:
Why ISC? I tend to love everything from the hands of Denny Moorhouse (or however his name is spelled).
Click to expand...

I always liked ISC too even though I don't own any ISC stuff. The reason i include is ISC is based only on hearsay but some other stuff tends to back it up. I've been told that ISC sources from this same manufacturer as Kong, King Snaps. As nearly as I can tell, from the info so far, King Snaps is the OEM for the rings that failed. It's classic product fade from the Pacific Rim.

Take a look at the top right corner of the pic on King Snaps' home page... look familiar? My guess is ISC designed the Snaphook and King Snaps makes them... and sells their own version.

I've said on the Buzz, I wish ISC would step up and prove me wrong... cuz 'I don't wanna be right'.
 
Meh, they sound like alright guys...

Under ISO 9001 standard and 25 years of manufacturing, we are sure that best quality controls manufacturer, prompt delivery and after service will be fully satisfied with you.

Researching and developing are always our final goals. New and precise products will be continuous by our teams of engineer and sales.

Kindly send your samples or drawing for immediate quotation. Any questions or problems can be directly contacted with us.

Of course, I carry more liability insurance than they do.
P.S. PRODUCTS LIABILITY INSURANCE USD 2,000,000.00
 
Tobe,

I think your batch theory may be correct; I have seen the pictures, and from the appearance of the break I'd submit the metal missed a heat treatment at some step; perhaps they weren't stress-relieved properly.

If anyone has access to a hardness tester, I'd love to see the results of doing a hardness test on the failed rings versus others.
 
What basically determines the reason why the rings broke? Is lack of hardness and therefore poor tensile strength the important factor? I was thinking fatigue strength is the criteria. Been trying to research it, but still am confused.
 
NickfromWI said:
I wouldn't be suprised if King stole the design from ISC.
Click to expand...

Exactly... after ISC gave them the specs so they could make them. That's how it goes. You design it and then shop it with Pacific Rim manufacturers to make it for a tenth of the price it costs in the West. Then they make their own knock off because they don't respect patents.

I think ductility would be a major factor. The ring should deform before it breaks. My guess is, hardness is too high. The skipped heat treatment theory sounds probable.
 
If your aluminum hardware EVER hits the ground, it is suspect
Click to expand...

I am not sure about how valid this statement is. From what I understand from Denny Moorhouse's statements, you would need to have visible fracture lines to condemn a piece of equipment.
Alum does not shatter? but deforms? Not really sure but maybe someone could step up and explain this about alum.
 
Frans said:
Alum does not shatter? but deforms? Not really sure but maybe someone could step up and explain this about alum.
Click to expand...

I think it depends on the alloy and heat treatment but life support gear should definitely give warning by deforming before it fails.

Hey John/Tobe, did the rings you tested deform before they broke or are they just snapped in half circles?
 
Blinky said:
I always liked ISC too even though I don't own any ISC stuff. The reason i include is ISC is based only on hearsay but some other stuff tends to back it up. I've been told that ISC sources from this same manufacturer as Kong, King Snaps. As nearly as I can tell, from the info so far, King Snaps is the OEM for the rings that failed. It's classic product fade from the Pacific Rim.

Take a look at the top right corner of the pic on King Snaps' home page... look familiar? My guess is ISC designed the Snaphook and King Snaps makes them... and sells their own version.

I've said on the Buzz, I wish ISC would step up and prove me wrong... cuz 'I don't wanna be right'.
Click to expand...

You are correct, Blinky. The forgings are the same. only color and names are different. Although exactly how many of the products are produced this way is unknown.
 
Blinky said:
Exactly... after ISC gave them the specs so they could make them. That's how it goes. You design it and then shop it with Pacific Rim manufacturers to make it for a tenth of the price ...
Click to expand...

I'm thinking ISC has too much pride to let them make stuff in China. Their stuff is THAT good!

Let's see what I can find out....
 
Dave, Re: dropped gear. Black Diamond did a bunch of testing on dropped carabiners several years ago. The conclusion was that some people are trashing perfectly good gear. Not a single dropped biner failed at less than its rating-including some that had scratches and gouges that would make a prudent person scrap them or downgrade them to a gate latch. The article is out there on the web-actaul test results and some good explanation as to whya properly made piece of Aluminium gear shouldn't be damaged by a fall that produces no significant visible damage to the exterior.

Regarding the unmarked rings.......I have a FS I made with them prior to 2008. (2005 I think) I have only climbed on it a few times.............But a whole bunch of techs at the last couple RMC-TCCs have hung on it. I suppose that now I'll just scrap it.
 
gf beranek said:
Nick, Denny is retired now and he sold ISC to some young fellows. ISC had the booth next to me in Providence and I had lots of time to talk to the new owners.
Click to expand...

When I talked to Denny a few years ago, he seemed like the guy that wanted to hand make every carabiner himself just to make sure it was done right.

I hope th new owners share that passion.

love
nick
 
I agree, Nick. Denny was one of the original equipment manufactures and had a lot of pride in his products.

He started Clogwyn Climbing Gear in 1966 making making nuts for rock climbers. In 1981 he started DMM manufacturing. Though as years went on board members in the hierarchy gave him the boot, and so Denny then started ISC in 1995. He told me that he lost control of the manufacturing process at DMM and had to leave. Now he sold ISC and is living in the Philippines.
 
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