SRT Question

[treesmith]

Hello to all fellow arborists,
I'm brand new to this forum and had a question for all ya'll out there. I've been into tree work for 23 years, counting the time I spent climbing for Asplundh. Been on my own for 16 years now. Problem is, I live in a small town/rural area that isn't conducive to steady tree work. So I got into that easy lucrative business that everybody's standing in line for...roofing. Actually made a decent living between the two occupations. Anyway, I've always used bodythrusting to get into a tree when I didn't want to use hooks. Now that I'm getting older, I'm looking into SRT, having seen it on several videos and in various books/articles. I don't know whether I want to try the FROG system, the Texas Climbing System, Mar-Bars or ...you get the picture. Any advice for an SRT beginner? I don't mind the cost of the Mar-Bar system if it's worth it, but I can get the FROG from Sherrill for nearly half the cost. H-E-L-P......! Thanks

 

[MasterBlaster]

Welcome to the TreeHouse, Treesmith! Do you have a first name? Mine's Butch.

I don't know diddly about your question, but we've a couple SRT'ers here.

 

[sawinredneck]

Welcome, I can't answer anything either!

Andy here.

 

[Burnham]

Dodge the Mar-Bars, imo. Newer technologies for easier climbing exist.

The Tree Frog system works pretty well, though I really think a double handled ascender is a worthwhile upgrade, as is an adjustable length left foot tether.

Texas system is the easiest to learn to operate, I believe, but generates higher dynamic loads on your anchor point than the TF. If you go this way, avoid the pre-made tether sets and tie up your own...you need to be able to fine tune the lengths to your arm length and stride to be most efficient.

 

[treesmith]

Thanks for the welcome!

Thanks for the advice Burnham. And thanks for the welcome Butch and Andy. I'm Scott, and glad to "meet" ya'll. By the way, I was also wondering (I hope this is the right place for this topic), has anyone out there tried using 3-strand (5/8" or 3/4") with two rings spliced in for a homemade friction saver? Plenty strong enough and lots cheaper as well as any length needed (especially if using the prussik adjustment method). Any ideas....?

 

[Wagnaw]

Thanks for the advice Burnham. And thanks for the welcome Butch and Andy. I'm Scott, and glad to "meet" ya'll. By the way, I was also wondering (I hope this is the right place for this topic), has anyone out there tried using 3-strand (5/8" or 3/4") with two rings spliced in for a homemade friction saver? Plenty strong enough and lots cheaper as well as any length needed (especially if using the prussik adjustment method). Any ideas....?

Not to bash SRT, but you may want to try double ascenders and footlocking. It's fast, and if you are patient enough with yourself to get good at footlocking, it is super easy and non-gear intensive. Footlocking also doesn't require small diameter ropes.

A three strand friction saver would be fine probably, but you may want to use a narrower cord than 5/8 because you want enough room for your rope to pass through the rings without rubbing the 3-strand. Try 1/2".

 

[FJR]

Burnham mentioned the frog system working pretty well and I agree also. It gets faster and easier to use the more you use it.

If your not into all of the gear, then Wagnaw's suggestion is really good too.

 

[treesmith]

Hi Wagnaw, could you explain...do you mean two ascenders on different legs of rope (DRT?) or do you mean two ascenders, one above the other on single rope? And thanks for the point on rope size...I hadn't thought of that. However, if I build the adjustable type with a prrussik, that side's cord would be small enough to work wouldn't it? The only friction saver I've used so far is the leather type (except when I've used a pulley/sling combination).

 

[Wagnaw]

I mean an ascender with two handles and a cam that works on both legs of the rope. Here's a pic of the Kong double ascenders.

I'll usually use a prussik vs. the double-ascenders, but these allow you to sit down and take a break during ascent, which is REALLY nice.

 

[Wagnaw]

...And thanks for the point on rope size...I hadn't thought of that. However, if I build the adjustable type with a prrussik, that side's cord would be small enough to work wouldn't it? The only friction saver I've used so far is the leather type (except when I've used a pulley/sling combination).

If I'm understanding you right, you want the rope to run through two rings... one is on the length of 3-strand rope and another is on the prussic. You don't want your rope to rub going through either of those rings, and if you're making it retrievable, you also want to make sure that the larger of the two rings still allows your retrieval device to pass through it.

 

[treesmith]

Will the Kong double also work on single rope? Also, can you not stop and rest while supported by the prussik? I can see a definite advantage in having a better hand grip with the Kong vs. gripping the rope itself. Is that all you generally use...prussik or Kong and footlocking?

 

[treesmith]

As to the friction saver question...Sherrill sells a friction saver prussik to add to the Buckingham Friction Saver. You can see a fairly good picture in their catalog. It allows the friction saver to be adjusted to the stem size of the tree (allowing one long FS to fit all applications). Wesspur sells the friction saver rings alone to make your own. Both can be bought for under $10. I've got extra rope lying around and enjoy splicing my own stuff.

 

[Wagnaw]

Yeah man! If you like and trust your splicing, then splice away. I splice all my own prussics and climbing lines. I've done friction savers too, but I prefer the buckingham ones. The only reason I was cautioning you about the 5/8" friction saver is that I made one once out of 5/8 double braid, and it was too fat in the rings to let the rope run through without rubbing.

As far as ascents go... SRT footlock for long ascents, and DbRT prussic footlock for short ascents.

 

[PCTREE]

Hey Scott, good to have you on board. I have a set of marbars that I never use anymore with a fresh 150 static line if you are interested.......

My names Paul

 

[treesmith]

Wagnaw, do you normally use a prussik or ascender on those long SRT climbs?

 

[treesmith]

Hi Paul, nice to meet you. I'm not sure which SRT sytem I want to go with yet...just got this thread going today. I'm trying to pick as many brains as possible before shelling out the dough. Got an idea what you'd like to have for the Marbars? What type rope do you normally use for them? Will any climbing line work? How easy are they to use compared to the FROG?

 

[treesmith]

What got me really interested in SRT was watching Gerald Beranek's Treehouse Project dvd. It shows Mark Chisolm burning it up the tree. I'm sure it's not as easy as it looks, but compared to bodythrusting, it looked effortless. I emailed Mark and he said he wasn't using the FROG, but a system called the ropewalker (which I understand to be a variation of the FROG)???

 

[Wagnaw]

Definitely an ascender. I know of people who will footlock SRT with a prussic, but they're pretty few and far between. I've done it on 1/2" static using a "weapon" system, but just to try it out and play around a bit.

 

[treesmith]

By the way, Wagnaw, what type cord do you make your prussiks out of? I'm wanting to try split-tail climbing and don't know whether to use Ice, Beeline or what. Do you use a prussik for your friction hitch? I hope I'm not running this in the ground, but it's refreshing to get to "discuss" all this with like-minded folks. As to the Buckingham friction savers...how long do they last? That's one reason I was going to make my own. One would cost me less than $20, and would be adjustable from 4' down.

 

[treesmith]

So all you have going up with you is one ascender attached to your saddle via caribiner? If so, how long is your tether?

 

[Wagnaw]

I think my tether is 24"? I'm actually not sure. Ohh... and remember to back up your ascender when you climb, and maybe some other people will chime in with picture if you're looking for examples.

Ohh.... and I like HRC the best of the hitch cords I've used.

 

[hmm]

Wagnaw, that asender and footlockin is nice, but the man said he has 16-20 year experience, that means his knees need TLC. I agree with the ascenders and a foot ascend er.

srt can be a little more gear (imo)

there are many tools that work with both SRT and Ddrt.

Welcome to the house

 

[treesmith]

What type hitch do you use? I've cosidered the VT, but I've always been old-school, using tautline or Blake's hitch. I've yet to try any of the prussik hitch sustems. The schwabisch looks like the simplest, but I saw a clip on Youtube of a VT that looked impressive. The prussik-minding pulley advancement looks slick.

 

[Wagnaw]

A swabish is a nice starting hitch to get used to the system. It binds reliably, which many people switching from the blakes hitch like. A friend of mine was a swabish nut for a long time, but then he had some pressure to finally switch to the VT. Now he's sold. If I were you, I'd try every knot you can find and pick one for yourself.

 

[PCTREE]

when using any srt system to get up a tree it is more efficient to use a static rope otherwise you feel like you are on a pogo stick, all your effort goes into stretching the rope instead of going up the tree. Marbars will work with pretty much any regular rope from 10mm-1/2inch but stable braid etc will be less efficient especially on long hauls with lots of stretchy rope