OSHA and company owners

[emr]

I have heard for a long time that if you are the owner of a company that OSHA's rules don't apply to you. So, let's say that if you were cutting with a chainsaw on the ground and you had no ppe on and OSHA stopped taking by, they could not give you a fine as long as you own the company. Have any of you heard of this?

To me it doesn't make much sense however, in Wisconsin if you are the owner of a LLC, you can not be covered by workers compensation insurance. So we are required to have it for employees but not if the LLC only consists of owners. That doesn't really make sense to me either.

I hope this post made sense to someone.

 

[gf beranek]

You are not confused. It's just law and bureaucrats.

 

[SkwerI]

I'm a sole proprietor. I don't have any employees. OSHA rules (and Worker's Comp insurance) are for employees. I'm not an employee.

 

[Burnham]

The regs are in place to protect employees from unsafe working conditions imposed on them by their employer. That's the sole intent.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Well, I sorta of went off on Rob today like I was OSHA. Almost pinned himself between the truck and the chipper trying to hitch it up. His impatience almost got him hurt bad. I fuggin went off. 10 - 15 seconds I would have been helping him with the hook up on a hill. He dismissed it that he just had the chock move on him.. Shat like that will get someone seriously hurt of killed. Impatience will eventually bite you.

 

[emr]

I guess I could have answered my own question. This is from osha.gov:

Who OSHA Covers
Private Sector Workers
Most employees in the nation come under OSHA's jurisdiction. OSHA covers private sector employers and employees in all 50 states, the District of Columbia, and other U.S. jurisdictions either directly through Federal OSHA or through an OSHA-approved state program. State-run health and safety programs must be at least as effective as the Federal OSHA program. To find the contact information for the OSHA Federal or State Program office nearest you, see the Regional and Area Offices map.

State and Local Government Workers
Employees who work for state and local governments are not covered by Federal OSHA, but have OSH Act protections if they work in a state that has an OSHA-approved state program. Four additional states and one U.S. territory have OSHA approved plans that cover public sector employees only. This includes: Connecticut, Illinois, New Jersey, New York, and the Virgin Islands. Private sector workers in these four states and the Virgin Islands are covered by Federal OSHA.

Federal Government Workers
Federal agencies must have a safety and health program that meet the same standards as private employers. Although OSHA does not fine federal agencies, it does monitor federal agencies and responds to workers' complaints. The United States Postal Service (USPS) is covered by OSHA.

Not covered by the OSH Act:
Self-employed;
Immediate family members of farm employers that do not employ outside employees; and
Workplace Hazards regulated by another Federal agency (for example, the Mine Safety and Health Administration, the Federal Aviation Administration, the Coast Guard).

 

[NeTree]

Yep; You can tell them to take a flying poke at a rolling donut, if you want.

 

[emr]

I wonder if they would still come and do one of their site visits if you requested one? I don't really think that we are violating any rules, but it would be interesting to find out.

 

[Reddog]

Don't do it. We got fined any time they showed up, even when invited. Contact your insurance provided and see what they offer for consults.

 

[NeTree]

Sure. And then you can call the IRS, and ask for an audit, to make sure you didn't miss anything, too.

 

[emr]

But if we are both owners then they could not fine us for anything. And as far as the IRS goes, we use an accountant so she would be to blame for anything they find...... Right?

 

[Monkeywithasaw]

Just because there's honey in a bee hive doesn't mean u have to shake it to get it out

 

[gf beranek]

Invite the fox, hey?

 

[SouthSoundTree]

But if we are both owners then they could not fine us for anything. And as far as the IRS goes, we use an accountant so she would be to blame for anything they find...... Right?

You can blame her for the money you will have to pay. She will not be paying it.




In WA state, where the state gov't runs WC, the owner has the option to cover themself. They have to comply with the safety rules. It they elect to not be covered, they don't have to comply with squat, IF I understand correctly from speaking with Dept. of Labor and Industries. WI state is different, and this doesn't apply.

 

[emr]

My comments about calling in OSHA and about blaming the accountant were tongue and cheek. However today my partner and I were talking about this thread and one thing that we can't really figure out is why owners can't get works comp. I mean what is the difference between workers comp insurance and regular insurance? My partners wife works for an insurance company that sells both personal and business insurance so he was going to talk to her and she if she can shed some light on the subject. I guess all of this is neither here nor there but it would be nice to have a better understanding of the system.

 

[FJR]

Not sure about WI, but in IL WC for the owner is optional, so you can have it. Not sure why you would want to though.

 

[squisher]

Same as up here in BC.

I carry comp for employees and private liability insurance for myself that covers me 24/7 for more than I could get from comp for less cost.

 

[Cobleskill]

Comp fights tooth and nail not to pay a claim. Not really the kind of insurance you want.

 

[sotc]

I'm just finishing up my first comp claim and have been quite impressed with how both me and my employee have been informed, comped and generally treated over all

 

[Cobleskill]

I think it is state by state. NY comp is a big PIA. So is liability for tree work. Must be lots of money passed hands. Why you can't buy from out of state is a mystery.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

Comp fights tooth and nail not to pay a claim. Not really the kind of insurance you want.

Can be true.


I like to know that I can go to the doctor and have the bills paid. If I were to get a stick in the eye, or crush my foot, cut myself, or whatever, without WC, I figure that I'd be screwed. Long term disability insurance has been suggested to me, but it doesn't pay the doctor's bills. WC is pretty cheap here in WA.

 

[treesmith]

I carry comp for employees and private liability insurance for myself that covers me 24/7 for more than I could get from comp for less cost.

But is the liability insurance the same as comp? I mean, if you were injured on your job, would it pay your medical cost as well as pay you during your time of recovery? My liability is to cover damage to property and or personal injury of others while on the job. It would pay up to a certain amount of medical expense, but it doesn't cover me at all.

My understanding of comp is that it would pay medical costs as well as so much per week while off work.....is this correct, or am I mistaken?

Back when I was in the roofing business, I checked on comp. I could get it on my employee(s), but not on myself. (The cheapest I found was 33%). And the liability insurance I checked on for roofing wouldn't even cover a job in progress. In other words, if, while in the course of roofing a house, it came a flood and ruined some sheetrock, etc, they wouldn't pay a thing. Only if there were a problem in the future with recurring leaks...I told them to forget it. The only reason I wanted it was in case of water damage. Aside from that, unless you let a bundle of shingles slide off and hit a car, etc, there is nearly no property risk with roofing. (At least as far as I was concerned).

I had liability insurance on my tree business for several years with an outfit that increased my rate EVERY year. I switched over to a friend of mine, and it's less now than I was paying ten years ago, and I have three times the coverage.

 

[sotc]

My guy recieved 66% of his wages averaged over the 52 preceeding weeks.
Sean, how much does it run in Washington?

 

[wiley_p]

For a tree company Willie, it's stupid cheap. That will be changing soon. Something in the neighborhood of 60 cents an hour.

 

[sotc]

Based on hours?! Makes far more sense than on wages. If I feel a guy has become more efficient, more experienced etc and I give him a raise, comp makes more money too Not that my rate is bad now that i'm out of the assigned risk pool