Must Mankind Beat Something to be Healthy?

[Jomo]

All I'm saying, is that I am confused by what you are wanting to say. Your recent post example, from my perspective, introduced instability into the issue, I think it is reasonable to say that Karen was a very messed up young lady with her desire for extreme dieting that ended up killing her, and probably a factor beyond simply not using her drums. Earlier you appeared to be claiming that there is a basic human need to be destructive. Is your basic premise that if someone needs to smash, it is because they are psychologically unhealthy, or the need to be destructive is perhaps something "normal", resulting from our genetic makeup?

The latter Jay.

The terrible two's are all too familiar to most parents. Teens raising hell's nothing new under the sun either, and hormones are an inherent aspect of teenage life.

It may sound callous and uncaring, but in my opinion training dogs and training teens are not that dissimilar, in that being consistent is the key to success IME as a parent and long time dog owner.

Jomo

 

[Jomo]

Should be an interesting test of big pharma's clout in our U.S. Justice system whether they drug test these two teenage murderers and publish the results as quickly as they published Sandra Bland's testing positive for pot?

I'd bet money they were both on some form of SSRI's.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/franciswhittaker/broken-arrow-family-deaths#.nkGlE098dy

Jomo

 

[Limbrat]

I can easily see how that also translates into how these same young people can better communicate with adults in a more respectful and polite way, being more disciplined in how they can control themselves, including use of language. It seems to be a good guide. If you can get self control going at a young age, I think it is very positive. I'd prefer that over having to beat on things.

That discipline has been lost in the American public school system Jay. As a youngster, our school principle was highly respected and feared. Today it would be said by our liberal society that the kind of discipline he dished out was cruel and inhumane and no doubt he would be brought up on criminal charges, but when he walked into a room you could hear a feather fall.
Self discipline? Rare indeed these days. Stig talked of overweight cops, true enough in most places, no self discipline, no discipline from their leaders. When I'm disciplined by my wife into going shopping with her, I usually find a seat and people watch. I'm amazed at how fat and soft (not hard as a spike like Jim) most folks are nowadays. I think that there's probably not many that could do an honest, physical day's work in this heat.

 

[woodworkingboy]

Ray, it's been lost a lot here as well. Years ago when I first experienced the place, the two things that most immediately impressed me, were how dignified the elderly people were, you could see it in their faces and how they carried themselves, and then there was the youth. They walked straight and seemed alert, and appeared dutiful about how they went about things. I met adults that wanted to introduce me to their teachers that they still had a relation with from when they were in high school, even grammar school. I think it's a real good positive sign of how a society is doing, when both the youth and the elderly are in good shape. A big part of it is how the elderly can still influence the young. Sadly, much has changed. Particularly the elderly have lost confidence.

 

[FireFighterZero]

I was taught to respect my elders. No drugs like ritalin.

But I told that drunken sonofabitch Principal of mine to hit me once. He wouldn't do it. Same thing with my shop teacher. I would have hurt them badly, or they would have at least felt it the next day. No matter how hard they tried, my folks could not get me to believe that age and authority automatically equaled respect.

 

[cory]

Haha!! What grade were you in when you almost duked the principal?

 

[FireFighterZero]

I was a freshman. Sophmore when I told my shop teacher to piss off.

Not like I was a young kid I guess.

 

[FireFighterZero]

 

[MasterBlaster]

Hahahaaa

 

[woodworkingboy]

Every shop teacher i ever had was cool, and I've had a few. Wonder what the deal was with yours?

 

[stig]

That's funny Stig, as both my Dad and judo instructor were very strict disciplinarians, my Dad with his belt, and Pop Moore with his Korean baton!

Pop Moore pretty much founded The American Judo Association after WW2 I've been told.

http://www.usja-judo.org/history-of-the-usja/


Jomo

I wasn't so much talking about discipline, but about instilling the true spirit of martial arts.

I have taught hundreds of kids the basics of karate, both here and in California.

Go beat someone up sure wasn't part of my teaching curricula.

But then I'm probably just old fashioned.

 

[Jomo]

The whole reason that judo has always been more appealing to me, unlike karate etc?

It allows you to subdue your opponent without doing them serious harm, no blows need be used at all. More a matter of balance n leverage, and using your opponent's momentum to your advantage.

IMO it should be mandatory for cops to learn the basics of, and then some.

Jomo

 

[MasterBlaster]

Judo is just fun wrestling.

 

[stig]

Judo is Jigoro Kano's idea of a sport and healthy fun version of the old Jujutsu/JiJutsu/Jiujutsu ( Lots of different ways to spell that one).
He basically took all the nasty tecniques out of it and turned it into a sport.
Same thing happened to Aikido when Yueshiba got his hands on it. Used to be Aikijutsu.
Karate, too, has been turned into a "Do".
That happened when it was brought to Japan from Okinawa to be used as a "sport" in school in order to make the kids better prospects for a later inrollment in the army.
99% of all karate today is Karate do, where it used to be Karate jutsu.

Do is a way to get healthy in mind and body, jutsu is more like learning the trade of unarmed combat.

Having done both, I prefer the last, but it is not something you involve kids and young adults in.

 

[Jomo]

Despite 40 years having gone by since attending Pop Moore's judo class, I still remember him shouting wasari once I'd thrown an opponent somewhat successfully, and eepon when I'd thrown and pinned my opponent correctly, indicating the match was over and I'd won.

The interesting thing to me about Pop's classes was that each student, starting with the white belts(beginners) had to fight the next equal or higher ranked student until they lost a match. The result being each student in the class getting their butt's handed to them except the highest ranked and most skillful blackbelt attending the class that day.

Meaning I got my butt kicked by a better student every class I attended!

Jomo

 

[woodworkingboy]

Being able to succeed beyond what you think are your limitations, is a big part of the Japanese approach to training, in quite a few numbers of disciplines. Saying it another way, people don't know their capabilities. It's one reason why thinking is not encouraged, but just following and mimicking.

 

[squisher]

That's the same way I trained people, don't think just do it the way I do. Lol.

 

[woodworkingboy]

Yeah, and taking it even farther, don't even explain anything. They can think about the why themselves. If people want your methods bad enough, they can steal them from you. In the more dangerous trades that method can have limitations, but making people work harder to learn something, though you will get quitters, isn't at all bad, if it compels them to honor their own efforts to learn and get good at something, and not end up tossing what they have learned away so easily. Why people quit something so easily is worth thinking about. It's actually a quite common expression in my neck of the woods, "stealing techniques" from your teacher. Baby people and they stay babies. Relatively non verbal training has a long history in these parts. Kind of a different approach from the west, where people tend to be more expectant of everything being handed to them. Apprentices in the old way of doing things, aren't deserving of anything until they have shown the strength of their ambition and commitment. Basically, their value as people is zero when they begin. It's a tough world to enter, but stay and likely you will be glad you did. When the teach buys you a beer or invites you over to his house to enjoy his wife's cooking, man it can mean something....it can almost make you cry.

 

[Jomo]

Good stuff Jay.

Jomo