Al Smith
Mac Daddy
Ha,in my book that's a new one .
361 muffler Mod
- Thread starter arborworks1
- Start date
- Replies 69
- Views 15K
E
ewsa
Guest
I just got done modding the muffler on my 372 like Skwerl did in the performance exhaust thread. I cut out a hole in the front plate and sandwiched a screen in between. Cut the tabs off the tuning screews. Saw seemed to cut without any sort of backing down. It seemed more powerful. Tomorrow it will get a real workout.
GASoline71
'cause chicks dig scars
Just remember you have to replace the limiter caps on the carb screws. There are no tension springs on them. Without the caps in place they can turn from vibration. Just cut the little tab off of them and put them back in... EZPZ...
Gary
Gary
W
Wagnaw
Guest
Where do you all learn how to do all these modifications? I don't know how comfortable I'd be poking holes in $800 saws unless there were some pretty standard and accepted ways of doing it.
I like learnin'
I like learnin'
GASoline71
'cause chicks dig scars
Loggers out here have been doing it to saws since there have been saws... Always lookin' for more power out of lighter powerheads.
Gary
Gary
SkwerI
Treehouser
For some of us, it's simply years of running, maintaining and repairing the saws we had. Then as the new EPA restrictions came about, we saw the 'improvements' and the problems they caused. A muffler mod is simply trying to undo the stupid EPA fix so the saw will run correctly.
Young guys like you never ran a saw without an EPA choked down muffler so you don't know what it's supposed to run like. You think you have to 'break in' a saw or something before you can 'mod' it. You don't see the damage caused by running an EPA muffler overheating your saw and choking performance. I just want to prevent the EPA mandates from ruining my saw and burning it up.
Young guys like you never ran a saw without an EPA choked down muffler so you don't know what it's supposed to run like. You think you have to 'break in' a saw or something before you can 'mod' it. You don't see the damage caused by running an EPA muffler overheating your saw and choking performance. I just want to prevent the EPA mandates from ruining my saw and burning it up.
woodworkingboy
TreeHouser
Where do you all learn how to do all these modifications? I don't know how comfortable I'd be poking holes in $800 saws unless there were some pretty standard and accepted ways of doing it.
I like learnin'
There are established conservative ways to modify a working saw (woods mod), where you aren't risking damage. How large to make openings, lightening a piston beyond a certain point is risky, etc.
If you get into porting, it's good to practice first on an old cylinder that won't be used. It's really not all that hard to do, but best to have a good understanding of where and how much to take off, whether you're after torque or rpms,...things like that. You have to be able to take good measurements down to .001", and porting also involves mapping the cylinder to know what the stock specs are, and how to measure the timing. It's a very deep and sometimes controversial subject, but just knowing the essentials can give safe and very satisfying results. Just staying with a muffler modification gives good results and is simple and not very risky. It often leads to wanting to do more, though.
There is a lot of information on the web about saw mods, and also a site that has excellent information exchanged...a lot of good people out there who will offer kindly assistance. It seems kind of daunting at first, but if you get into it, you can climb the learning curve pretty quick. It's kickazz fun, your saw will be talking to you. Modified saws rock!
Al Smith
Mac Daddy
Well, you want to learn how to tweek a saw ,here's a plan .Find you a 20 dollar Poulan 42-46 cc garage sale special. Make sure all the parts are there ,it isn't froze up and has spark .
Do some reading on the subject and have at it ,if you screw it up go find another one ,there's thousands of them . You get that Poulan cooking keep moving up . Before long you will at least be able to make a good runner out of a stock saw.Not a racer just a good cutter .
How some ever ,you don't always have to do a re-port job to get a good runner .90 percent of the time a simple half hour -45 minutes of work on a muffler gets most people tickled with the improvement .
Do some reading on the subject and have at it ,if you screw it up go find another one ,there's thousands of them . You get that Poulan cooking keep moving up . Before long you will at least be able to make a good runner out of a stock saw.Not a racer just a good cutter .
How some ever ,you don't always have to do a re-port job to get a good runner .90 percent of the time a simple half hour -45 minutes of work on a muffler gets most people tickled with the improvement .
W
Wagnaw
Guest
Nice. I've seen a couple old box store saws on craigslist. If I have a go at it, I'll let ya know how it works.
E
ewsa
Guest
I ran the hell out of the 372 today and was real impressed with how it ran. Apparently my little screen wasnt strong enough and is gone now, and I must not have torqued everything down as well as I should have because I'm down two bolts too, no big deal. The saw screams through wood. I dont have much experience tuning the saw and I think if I get that figured out it will run even better. Very happy I did it
Al Smith
Mac Daddy
I wouldn't be too concerned about the screen .Those folks in fire zones like Cal. or Idaho ,Washington state etc. need to use them but we in the hardwoods generally speaking do not .
Just be aware of the fact you should richen up the saw just a tad when it moves more air after fiddling with the muffler .Other than that --go-- get -em .
Just be aware of the fact you should richen up the saw just a tad when it moves more air after fiddling with the muffler .Other than that --go-- get -em .
Dave Shepard
Square peg, round world.
I can see why you guys with the 361's are modding them. Stopped by a friends place today and he was clearing for a pole barn. Had two 361's and his new 660 running. Those 361's definitely didn't seem to run like they should, kinda soggy.
woodworkingboy
TreeHouser
After you've done a few mods, no saw seems to run like it should, at least the newer ones. Have yet to alter the 880 though, but I like to read Carl talking about his.
arborworks1
Treehouser
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #39
Yeah I'm thinking about working on the 880.
Most likely sending it off and getting some real serious work done to it. And one of my 460's!
Most likely sending it off and getting some real serious work done to it. And one of my 460's!
squisher
THE CALM ONE!!!!
Where you thinking of sending it?
arborworks1
Treehouser
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #41
I haven't gotten that far, squishy. Just a thought right now. I need to use it a little more, first.
W
Wagnaw
Guest
Yeah... I've run a 460 for a while, and the 361 does seem a little held back. I can't figure out if it's in my brain from reading ya'll or if it's that I'm so used to using the 460 to fly through everything
squisher
THE CALM ONE!!!!
My modded 361 will give a stock 46 a run for it's money
. And yes I have two 46's with which to compare to. I'm considering buying a 460 this winter, breaking it in a little on the woodpile and then sending it off to get amped up for the next season. I think the 460 with a woods mod would be a awesome saw to have in the line-up.
. And yes I have two 46's with which to compare to. I'm considering buying a 460 this winter, breaking it in a little on the woodpile and then sending it off to get amped up for the next season. I think the 460 with a woods mod would be a awesome saw to have in the line-up.
woodworkingboy
TreeHouser
Ever thought about modding your own saws, Squisher? It's a pretty cool practice.
squisher
THE CALM ONE!!!!
I'm considering practicing on a older saw this winter, I would like to get into it myself for sure. Treehouse will be first place I come for advice if I do!
arborworks1
Treehouser
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #46
I am comfortable with the muffler stuff, but I would need some hands on experience porting. Polishing is no biggy. Not sure if that does much for a 2 stroke.
arborworks1
Treehouser
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #47
What kind of tools do you use to port saws? I am going to mess around with my 250. Where to begin?
woodworkingboy
TreeHouser
Just about any aspect of modifying, aside from muffler mods, is subject to varying opinions. Most people think that polishing the exhaust port after enlarging, will give additional gains.
Sticking within the parameters of a basic mod to raise compression and give better gas flow, lightening the piston, will give satisfying results.
Sticking within the parameters of a basic mod to raise compression and give better gas flow, lightening the piston, will give satisfying results.
woodworkingboy
TreeHouser
Dremel tool and bits is pretty ideal for porting and polishing. You can do it with a drill as well, and even hand filing will work on the intake and exhaust ports. I begin by raising compression. I generally eliminate the cylinder base gasket and use a sealant there instead.
You need to learn how to measure squish, that is the clearance between the top of the piston and the top of the cylinder, using solder. Research it on the web a bit, and I can help you if you want.
A lathe might be required if you have to reduce the height of the piston, once the cylinder is lowered. Taking the squish measurement without the base gasket will tell you that.
I can send you the basic approach information, that which was given to me and really helped.
Oh yeah, a compression gauge is useful too, to measure your gains. You can get too high as well.
You need to learn how to measure squish, that is the clearance between the top of the piston and the top of the cylinder, using solder. Research it on the web a bit, and I can help you if you want.
A lathe might be required if you have to reduce the height of the piston, once the cylinder is lowered. Taking the squish measurement without the base gasket will tell you that.
I can send you the basic approach information, that which was given to me and really helped.
Oh yeah, a compression gauge is useful too, to measure your gains. You can get too high as well.
Al Smith
Mac Daddy
I actually did one with a bunch of files one time .I figured of old Lambert could do it so can Al .
A Dremel works very well and is cheap . High priced flex tools like a Dunmore or Fordum are the best but they really remove stock quickly . Good if you have good hand and eye coordination but bad if you do not . Besides that they cost a bunch and the tooling is pricey also .
The process is not as difficult as some so called builders would like to let you think it is .I'm not in any way saying these folks do bad work or anything but it's not that hard to get some improvement on a working saw by doing a little port adjusting .Still in all the most gains you will see or most dramatic is just a muffler modification .
A Dremel works very well and is cheap . High priced flex tools like a Dunmore or Fordum are the best but they really remove stock quickly . Good if you have good hand and eye coordination but bad if you do not . Besides that they cost a bunch and the tooling is pricey also .
The process is not as difficult as some so called builders would like to let you think it is .I'm not in any way saying these folks do bad work or anything but it's not that hard to get some improvement on a working saw by doing a little port adjusting .Still in all the most gains you will see or most dramatic is just a muffler modification .
