Valid Drivers License shines like a college degree these days.

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  • #51
Actually I have only quit one job for that reason. Not jobs plural.


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I found in all people I hired w/ no dl , most have many other underlying problems, in work and in life. Best way to check for sure is ask your insurance company to ad them to policy, had more than 5 people show me a valid DL , come to find out No you don't. You just have a valid ID.
 
August Hunicke said:
The boss would come down on you if the other guy screwed up? I've quit jobs for that reason.


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Yes, when we were late because he was still in bed drunk and I had to get him up I'd get it in the ear as well.
I didn't mind, I was 30 and knew this was my penance for spending my 20s pissed and stoned. I spent a year there, kept my mouth shut(ish) and my eyes open, learnt all I could and started up subbing and getting my own work.
 
If that person screws up . In the past I would just yell. Waste of time. Found it better to just fix the problem or adjust to the new situation they caused and immediately after confront crew and let them tell me how this can be avoided and why it even happened or if they don't know show them.i feel it Makes them think about what happened. My rule is u broke it,lost it or cut it by no cause except for being stupid u bought it or have to fix it out of pocket and your time. Tools and little whoops happen a lot less I noticed. Cleaner worksites, tools organized, crew communication . If someone doesn't think that's a good idea they'll let each other know and figure out what else they can do.My voice never gets scratchy anymore.
I look at it like this . If ur going to yell at me I probably won't listen and walk away, so why would it work if I did it to my guys
 
Running a football team I realised that managing people not easy, everyone does it differently.
Some asses you gotta kiss, some you gotta kick. I responded better to a kick.
 
Quite the thread, guys! Great story about your Yoda, August.....

Personally, I've never had a problem with substance abuse...(besides my internet addiction, hah), but have an amazing succession of problems with workers. First one worthy of note was John. Last day he worked was Oct 2002. I was speedlining poplar limbs, Nice Guy Dave was also on the ground. (I recall him learning some of my slightly advanced speedline techniques, as he'd done little of it at the time.....) Later that evening, I'd called upstairs to him about work time next day--(he'd been living at my house for a few months) No answer..same next am, so I went up there, to find John at his computer, head thrown back, mouth open, teeth bared, in rigor mortis... turned out, it was H OD.... his family and I knew he had issues, but thought it was coke or other drug with less serious OD consequences.

Then in 2008 or so, came Mickey, who ended up in an induced coma for several days, with Strep...flesh eating disease--heroin again... he'd been going downhill fast..shame, a great arborist he was. He'd tried to get workman's comp coverage, claimed a locust thorn was the cause, but the doctors knew better.....and me...

Next has been a series of three lowlifes, who I've tried to help out, but who have stolen from me repeatedly, to the tune of easily $30 k worth of camera gear and work gear.. Some of the stuff was stolen two three times, as the first prick, Eric Flanagan, got caught, and the cops recovered four saws at pawn shops. Next guy, Doug, (who had first worked for me way back in 2004 or so) blamed Eric on the thefts, asked for $400 from me to get some gear back. His story was that he had a line on what Eric had been doing--turns out he used the $ to get the stuff out of pawn himself...as he did feel guilty..later, after admitting to be stealing, he told me where a couple saws were, and the cops got them back. But he kept at it...still unsure who broke in and took me whole safe, 23 months ago now.....
Third prick stole some stuff, got a bit back but had to pay off pawn shop...could have stolen more of the stuff.
Last was Doug, for sure, who may have had a key, as there was no sign of break-in, but he took a chest pack with camera and lens, worth $5000, not two days after he'd showed up, begging for $50 to turn his phone on, so he could have a chance at getting a job in case he got a call.... a story of course so he could get his next fix... tried to make him leave for an hour or more, even slapped him...kept saying now, wouldn't leave, finally gave him the $40 and told him to never bother me again. Fucker did some jail not long after for attempted home invasion, of course cops would do nothing about all my problems, as I have no concrete proof of his nefarious activities.

Much of this wouldn't have happened if I had taken strong measures to keep these low life addicts away, from better house securing, and alarm systems.

As I've stated here, a few months ago, I got my Wraptor back, but paid $1100 to the (innocent) tree co owner who'd bought it a few months earlier, at pawn shop. Last fall, the tranny was out of my chip truck for a couple months while my mechanic dragged his feet at getting it fixed. I'd left my tools in the chip truck, but couldn't pin the boxes, only lock them. Any one of the three thieves could have kept or made a set of keys, and one of them stole mega stuff, well over $12 k worth..... I bought new lock cylinders, ground off the assemblies, and re pop riveted them only to find that the new keys worked the old locks and vice versa...damn it.....now I'm sure to pin the boxes..... and keep some gear in a storage unit.......
I didn't discover the theft for a couple weeks, but then did report serial numbers. Neither the cops or pawn shop would admit they'd screwed up--at either checking the serial numbers, in the cop's case, or sending the numbers in, as the pawn shop swore to me that they did....

It's been a depressing few years..... hope it's all over with... for the last few months, work is good, my attitude is better, and I've replaced the camera gear, and shooting like crazy, back skiing...about to get some needed dental work, and starting to chase some skirts......

Wheeee
 
Wow is right. I've been embarrassed to talk much about it all, as I know I'm partially responsible, for not doing better damage control..... or breaking some legs...or worse....(better....)
 
woodworkingboy said:
Wow 2! Maybe drugs shouldn't be made legal after all. Seems like a real epidemic.
Click to expand...

Maybe treatment options for people that want to get clean should be easier. Not the rehab or jail situations. Someone who really wants and needs help. The social stigma would be less, probably. More like AA. There is a local al-anon club. The people look rough. I say, "Good for you to try to manage the impact of alcoholism in your life-sphere. Chris' guy didn't want his family to know, and get the support he needs from them.
 
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  • #64
La becasse said:
Running a football team I realised that managing people not easy, everyone does it differently.
Some asses you gotta kiss, some you gotta kick. I responded better to a kick.
Click to expand...

Ya


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  • #65
jalegre0 said:
I found in all people I hired w/ no dl , most have many other underlying problems, in work and in life. Best way to check for sure is ask your insurance company to ad them to policy, had more than 5 people show me a valid DL , come to find out No you don't. You just have a valid ID.
Click to expand...

That's a really good point. I forgot about that. A couple years back I became suspicious that the guys drivers licenses were no good just because they couldn't pay their phone bill etc. so I thought how is it that these guys could maintain a valid license? So I told them that my insurance company had asked for their credentials. Just procedure. It was amazing how quickly they had magically JUST lost their valid licenses. Pisses me off, the lying and cheating mentality. They don't mind risking my stuff my name my credibility. My future.


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  • #66
With pressure from my insurance company and a little bit of handholding from me two of them got their licenses back. One of them is now in prison. This subject is triggering a lot of incidences and stories, I better get back to work.


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  • #67
rbtree said:
Quite the thread, guys! Great story about your Yoda, August.....

Personally, I've never had a problem with substance abuse...(besides my internet addiction, hah), but have an amazing succession of problems with workers. First one worthy of note was John. Last day he worked was Oct 2002. I was speedlining poplar limbs, Nice Guy Dave was also on the ground. (I recall him learning some of my slightly advanced speedline techniques, as he'd done little of it at the time.....) Later that evening, I'd called upstairs to him about work time next day--(he'd been living at my house for a few months) No answer..same next am, so I went up there, to find John at his computer, head thrown back, mouth open, teeth bared, in rigor mortis... turned out, it was H OD.... his family and I knew he had issues, but thought it was coke or other drug with less serious OD consequences.

Then in 2008 or so, came Mickey, who ended up in an induced coma for several days, with Strep...flesh eating disease--heroin again... he'd been going downhill fast..shame, a great arborist he was. He'd tried to get workman's comp coverage, claimed a locust thorn was the cause, but the doctors knew better.....and me...

Next has been a series of three lowlifes, who I've tried to help out, but who have stolen from me repeatedly, to the tune of easily $30 k worth of camera gear and work gear.. Some of the stuff was stolen two three times, as the first prick, Eric Flanagan, got caught, and the cops recovered four saws at pawn shops. Next guy, Doug, (who had first worked for me way back in 2004 or so) blamed Eric on the thefts, asked for $400 from me to get some gear back. His story was that he had a line on what Eric had been doing--turns out he used the $ to get the stuff out of pawn himself...as he did feel guilty..later, after admitting to be stealing, he told me where a couple saws were, and the cops got them back. But he kept at it...still unsure who broke in and took me whole safe, 23 months ago now.....
Third prick stole some stuff, got a bit back but had to pay off pawn shop...could have stolen more of the stuff.
Last was Doug, for sure, who may have had a key, as there was no sign of break-in, but he took a chest pack with camera and lens, worth $5000, not two days after he'd showed up, begging for $50 to turn his phone on, so he could have a chance at getting a job in case he got a call.... a story of course so he could get his next fix... tried to make him leave for an hour or more, even slapped him...kept saying now, wouldn't leave, finally gave him the $40 and told him to never bother me again. Fucker did some jail not long after for attempted home invasion, of course cops would do nothing about all my problems, as I have no concrete proof of his nefarious activities.

Much of this wouldn't have happened if I had taken strong measures to keep these low life addicts away, from better house securing, and alarm systems.

As I've stated here, a few months ago, I got my Wraptor back, but paid $1100 to the (innocent) tree co owner who'd bought it a few months earlier, at pawn shop. Last fall, the tranny was out of my chip truck for a couple months while my mechanic dragged his feet at getting it fixed. I'd left my tools in the chip truck, but couldn't pin the boxes, only lock them. Any one of the three thieves could have kept or made a set of keys, and one of them stole mega stuff, well over $12 k worth..... I bought new lock cylinders, ground off the assemblies, and re pop riveted them only to find that the new keys worked the old locks and vice versa...damn it.....now I'm sure to pin the boxes..... and keep some gear in a storage unit.......
I didn't discover the theft for a couple weeks, but then did report serial numbers. Neither the cops or pawn shop would admit they'd screwed up--at either checking the serial numbers, in the cop's case, or sending the numbers in, as the pawn shop swore to me that they did....

It's been a depressing few years..... hope it's all over with... for the last few months, work is good, my attitude is better, and I've replaced the camera gear, and shooting like crazy, back skiing...about to get some needed dental work, and starting to chase some skirts......

Wheeee
Click to expand...

Wow that sounds like you have quite a tendency toward rescue/social work. I've definitely tried a little too hard to help people that weren't as interested in helping themselves as I was. I hope your hiring standards have become stricter since then.


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Roger, with all due respect, you MUST secure your gear. It sounds like you are a good guy, but leave your business extremely vulnerable to thieves. I've not been robbed by a worker. Its hard for me to say this in any respectable way, but anyone that works with me enough knows I'll break their spine if they rob me.
 
Have to say that with the discussion about thieves and the problems associated with workers, I expect that you guys get used to it to a degree as a fact of life, but from the outside and reading about the potential problems that you face in those regards, man it really really sucks. :( I think that one problem in the states, is that people tend to regard themselves as individuals, much more than as part of a community and a family...parents, siblings and your own immediate. There isn't the stigma of embarrassment when you get caught for doing bad sheet. Individuality can be a fine thing, but....
 
I don't believe any one has done this work for any length of time with out knowing a character or two. These stories are great while at the same time sad & sobering
If we're honest as some here have been a lot of us have lived on both sides of the fence. Grateful I was able to jump that fence. It is much better on the this side.

August, your story was a good read!

It reminded of myself......& Ralph who I learned more about climbing trees from than any one. Ralph's father all 4 of his brothers a sister were all climbers. None of them second rate with the skills they brought.

Ralphs gone now has been for some time. Drank himself to death. Some of his last days were spent in a wheel chair. Broken leg that wouldn't heal because of the drink.
 
August Hunicke said:
Wow that sounds like you have quite a tendency toward rescue/social work. I've definitely tried a little too hard to help people that weren't as interested in helping themselves as I was. I hope your hiring standards have become stricter since then.


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I used to be like you, now I only help and trust people who earn it. Spent a fortune on cameras for surveillance , got an alarm. All tools are now unloaded into garage and then reloaded in the trucks every morning.
 
Considering all the moaning you hear about finding quality workers these days its possible a flexible case by case screening is the way to go. In my town (Sydney) its pretty common for workers to be waiting for their ride to work at the train station nearest the job. In my experience some of the best along with the worst have no DL- true though, the latter most often.
 
I suppose no one ever aspires to be a groundsman. It's just something one does whilst learning to climb, as a stop gap between "real" work, or it's just beer/drug money.
 
Finding workers is tough. Lately I've been having decent luck with workers from temp agencies, they cost more but for the most part, are decent and reliable, knock on wood.

My excellent climber has a friend who is tough, they both are tough, and have been in a lot of street fights, fwiw. A few months ago I learned the friend had started being a groundie for a tree service a couple towns over. I was bummed he hadn't signed on with me instead. So recently I asked my climber how his friend was doing with the tree work, he replied that he was working at a Ford dealership now. I reacted with surprise that he had moved on, given the kid's nature that I presumed would be highly compatible with tree work.

My climber, who has a tendency to say Yogi Berra-ish things, replied, "Cmon man, don't you know nobody wants to do tree work? Unless they want to do treework"

Lol, I think he's got a point there.
 
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