Where there is a winch, there is a way.

[arborist]

Hello all,

I was hoping for some feedback from the arborists using winches. I am in the market for a portable winch for clearing dead-fall and moving logs in remote areas in which I cant get my truck into. Right now i am leaning towards the winches from www.westcoastwinch.com they are portable, light weight and use capstan drum technology.

If anyone has used this type of winch before or have one that they swear by, please let me know. its quite an expensive investment, so i would like to be sure i am making the right decision, and you guys can help with that!

I will post and wait for your reply, Thanks!

 

[sawinredneck]

How much and what size wood are you wanting to move? I had this same dilemma a while back, buy the time I bought a winch, the ties, pulleys, cone (to keep wood from digging into the ground) and ropes, etc., I found it was a lot cheaper to buy a used mini skidsteer with a log grapple. It also opened up more uses from that piece of equipment.
Just a suggestion.

 

[Altissimus]

Andy is right... The Lewis Winch works great which I have borrowed, effective but lesser quality and price is the Rule winch I purchased. Gotta tell you they are not my favorite tool to run all day... the Farmi winches (pto tractor mount) are awesome when the skidder is too big

 

[Burnham]

The learning curve to efficient, safe use can be a bit steep, but not badly so. Don't stint on rigging gear, without it a winch is next to useless. Above all, stay out of the bight of the tensioned winch line.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Welcome to the TreeHouse, Arborist! Do you have a first name? Mine is Butch.

 

[arborist]

I would suggest that the size of trees that i am moving can be as heavy as 1500-2000 pounds.

Hey Butch, I'm James. First time poster.

 

[woodworkingboy]

I have used the winch shown (50cc one) in your link when doing some beetle infestation removals, where logs need to be cut to a specific length and stacked with the brush, a pesticide poured on and all covered with a plastic sheet that has it's edges buried in the ground. (A mouthful for what I consider to mainly be meaningless work other then the pay). Often on steep terrain in these parts, we pull up the logs to the stacking spot. I purchased the winch from the states for the company that gives me the option to work with them when I want, and when they have sufficient activities going. In this situation on steep ground, a winch is the only option. I don't know what I could tell you about that winch, other than it works very well and I consider it to be an excellent tool, and the instructions are easy to read. They recommend a specific rope that works best with the capstan.

I can't recall the weight pulling rating, I suggest you had better be clear on that to make sure that the capacity is sufficient for your purposes. The pulling efficiency is also varied by whether you are working on hard or soft ground. The winch requires some periodic maintenance, changing the oil.....

 

[Altissimus]

Wow Jay ... hope you didn't have apply the poison spray... another thing I have done is to rig an impovised Spar Block. With a suitable tree up top helps keep the logs and brush hitches from digging in

 

[sawinredneck]

I would suggest that the size of trees that i am moving can be as heavy as 1500-2000 pounds.

Hey Butch, I'm James. First time poster.

Welcome James, I'm Andy.
Without a doubt you will have to rig on higher trees to move that kind of weight. But I honestly can't see the justification for the amount of work you are talking about. Might be worth finding someone in the area that has done this work and cutting them in? Unless this is something you plan to continue?
I'm just trying to be a voice of reason, this is a LOT of expense for a single job, just food for thought.

 

[Altissimus]

I am Dave ... Welcome to the House... there I feel better, been a little cheap with Greets lately

 

[woodworkingboy]

Dave, I wasn't the official poison poureroner those days that I did that. One of those, "Everybody stand back", kind of things.

Jay here, welcome to the house. Hope you buy that winch if it fits your needs, the people that make it put out a good product. They sell a nose cone to keep the end of a log from digging in when you pull it. Never used one and we survived after getting the hang of it. Overdoing the weight makes for boring.

 

[arborist]

Hey Andy,

You are right about the expense...

The thing is that one main use for this Winch will be clearing dead-fall on my own property. And as you may know, that is sort of a continuous process. In addition, the Arborist work that i do, is more in the landscape industry and we often come across issues where a tool like this would come in handy (its not always ideal to drive your truck into someones backyard to pull a stump or log out).

However, i think you are right about the pulling capacity being an issue. Can i "block" this rope for a higher pulling capacity?

 

[bonner1040]

You can always use mechanical advantage, regardless of the input

 

[woodworkingboy]

I believe that there is a capstan option to go larger or smaller from what's on there as the standard, can't remember which. Affects capacity vs pull rate. Any mechanical advantage is going to slow the pull, and it is already pretty slow to begin with. I think that I have the data/instructions at the shop, because the company I purchased the winch for, nobody can read English. If there is something that you might want to know.

Pulling logs out of people's back yards denotes that you have something to attach the winch to in the line of pull that you want, like another tree, or otherwise getting creative. I think that tool particularly comes into its own on steep ground where there are no other options.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

Picket stakes/ ground anchoring or building a pile of logs for anchor are options will make a winch more useful in open areas where you may not be able to drive a vehicle to use as an anchor.

 

[Pelorus]

I own of those winches (made in Quebec, Canada incidentally). Excellent product.
You may want to purchase the optional tree mount as well.
Since it is a 4 stroke engine, operating angles can mean having to use a redirect.
I also bought the optional larger drum, which provides for faster speed, but a significant decrease in pulling power.
Just going by memory, the standard drum will pull up to 2500 lb, and the larger drum is around 1400lb.

 

[Pelorus]

Forgot to mention I also have a couple of the Simpson capstan winches powered by a chainsaw. Too big a saw = broken winch. (O28 = awesome. 044/440 = very bad). Both winches have their pros and cons, but the Honda powered winch will start on the first pull after sitting around for a month or more. And it doesn't spew bar oil on the rope like the Simpson one does.
A buddy actually has all three - Simpson, Lewis, and Portable Winch. His Lewis winch hasn't been used for probably close to 10 years.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

Possibly a good time to use canola oil if you don't all the time.

 

[woodworkingboy]

I seem to recall that with the capstan winch you are really only supposed to pull at an angle downward or more or less parallel to the ground. Much angle upwards is advised against, but i don't remember why. Undesirable stresses on the winch? I have heard of limited use pulling trees however, people that didn't read the cautions or whatever.

 

[Pelorus]

The Honda powered winch has an oil sensor kill switch that kicks in if the upward angle is too much.
A downward angle will bend the plate the winch sits on when using the tree mount.

 

[arborist]

This has been very informative so for, thanks to all contributing!

There appears to be a smaller model (PCW3000) that is an "all position" engine. so does that mean that it would pull on all sorts of different angles without a kill switch activating? At any rate, this model only has pulling capacity of 1500 lb. so quite limited in that sense.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

I haven't had a lot of opportunity to use my Simpson capstan http://madsens1.com/sa_simpson.htm. I have used it for pulling my chipper, 4450 pounds, with a block to create a 2:1.

I look forward to trying it with a DdRT with a pulley to pull myself up a tree, cutting some of the climbing strain.

It runs on a chainsaw powerhead, so runs in any direction.

Seems easier to use with two people, one for the throttle, and one for tensioning the tail of the rope. I'm experimenting with double sided velcro, formed into a loop.

I hear that grinding the rope slot a bit larger allows 1/2 inch rope to be easily pushed through the fairlead and wound on the capstan.

I think it will be well worth the money ($650 plus tax when I got it on sale at Madsen's). I just have to dial in the system with the crew, and have a spare powerhead. I'll run it on a 361, I think.

 

[Pelorus]

361 should be good. I have tried mine on a 026 / 261 with 3/8 sprocket, but it seemed to bog down too easy, which is why I went to the old 028.
Have never run Canola for bar oil, but sounds like an excellent idea.
About 12-15 years ago, Baileys and Madsens were selling the Simpson for $335.