SRT TIP cinch with hardware

[emr]

What's the advantage of this? I bought SRT Best Practices from TCIA and they show several methods for cinching the climbing line using a ring, delta, quick link, etc., and I guess I don't see the benefit. Anyone doing this?

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[bonner1040]

As opposed to a running bowline?

 

[emr]

I like alpine butterfly.

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[bonner1040]

With a cinched tie in retrievability is the issue. Whether you use a separate line or the 'dead' of the climbing line, any redirect that doesnt follow the 'retrieval' side creates a lot of friction. The friction of cinching with a knot, added to friction from redirects can make retrieval either difficult or impossible.

Hardware (delta link, quicklink, pulley, etc) reduce friction and enable midline attachment. If you need to relocate your main tie in, hardware also makes that easier.

 

[emr]

Does it really make a noticeable difference?

Say without hardware you can do 2 redirects, how many more can you do with hardware?

I know each tree is different.... I am just looking for generalities.

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[jefflovstrom@sb]

Is it retrievable from the ground?

 

[emr]

I believe they usually are.

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[kevin bingham]

It will protect your rope from burning as you pull the line out.

 

[MasterBlaster]

That's some fast pulling!

 

[pantheraba]

hahaha...same thing that went through my head!:tomcat:

 

[bonner1040]

You wont get two without a pulley

 

[Oldmilltreecare]

If you have set a cinched TIP, retrievability depends on your route down and the shape of the union that you have put your TIP on.
Getting it stuck a few times will teach you what to avoid in future. Sometimes it is just easier to go back up and untie at the end of the job.
Every tree is different and every set up is dictated by the tree.

 

[SouthSoundTree]

You wont get two without a pulley

????

 

[SouthSoundTree]

A great thing about a cinched TIP is that you can go over a small stub/ sprout that would never support body weight, but will support the force of the rope being remotely set and retrieved, right over a nasty, rope-eating inclusion.

 

[kevin bingham]

That's some fast pulling!

Or some hard pulling. If you have gone over a couple of redirects and have to yard down your knot there will be a nice glaze right in the loop of your cinch knot.

 

[emr]

What do you all use most? I guess I am about 50/50 for cinch and base anchor. However I am very new to this and I am just learning what kinds of trees do best with different anchors.

When I do cinch it off, I have only used the alpine butterfly. I like the looks of the ring and ring method shown in the TCIA best practices.

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[kevin bingham]

Removals or rigging its usually a canopy-tie. Some small tree are a canopy. Base tie on everything else.

 

[Porkbrick]

im about 50/50 cinch (running bowline) and ring ring fs. i really like the fs method. no worries about dummies on the ground or overloading my tip. also less bounce. i like to tie the tail of my rope to the bowline for retrieval. that way no matter what route i come down or how many crotches i drop through (as long as they are wide enough to pass the knot) the retrieval line is guaranteed to follow the same path.

 

[kevin bingham]

Try a bowline with a bight as it is midline attacheable.

 

[DMc]

I use a base tie 99% of the time. Even on removals it is the fastest way to get a rope set in the tree and start climbing. I find this to be one of the greatest aspects of SRT-WP climbing and really believe that it is not until you understand how to gauge the loads and can develop a work plan around what each specific tree is capable of, you will not be getting the best of what this versatile system has to offer.
When I do set a choked top tie it is usually an Alpine-Butterfly and a 3/8" screw link. This will be a midline choke tie and ground retrievable. The ring & ring works well and pulls out a little bit easier than a base tie but it needs to be set and then retrieved.

David

 

[bonner1040]

Eric, did you watch this already?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udvQRcXDcSY

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/udvQRcXDcSY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[Porkbrick]

to be sure, i do use a base tie when it is faster/easier. around here our oaks are open and spreading for the most part, easy to set a rb (doesnt necessarily have to be around a single limb or atthe best location, just the easiest). i almost never set my fs from the ground. i usually set my line with a rb near my best tie in, climb up, set the fs and work my way back down. its what works for me.

 

[emr]

I have seen that but thanks for the refresher.

One thing that I don't buy is the time savings with setting a base anchor. I don't bid my jobs that close where that would ever come into play. I probably agree with all other benefits but not that one.

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[bonner1040]

I like that.

 

[emr]

Disregard this post.

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