Question - Amsteel Blue

If I wasn't already placing an order for some goodies tomorrow, I would take one of ya up on it. Butttttttt... some shat has to come first... Then I want that Willys jeep for 2000....Running '59 with a winch.. hell of a deal I think....
 
Stephen, my neighbor bought this '49 Willys a few years ago for $800. Even has a Willys 4 cylinder flathead motor. He loves tinkering on it and puttering around town in it. Every once in a while I have to go rescue him when it conks out on him. :)
 
Yeah this one has the 4 cyl also... Has some parts I have to fix like wipers... but hey... I can get parts.. and I don't need it pretty for in and out of the woods... Its registered current and does not require smog. Uncle had one and went all over the ol Sierra trails to ghost towns and mines in it.
And back to the thread.. sorry guys.. ;)
 
I miss my Jeep! Lost it a year ago today:(

IMG_2074.jpg

8b916381.jpg
 
Need to wait another couple years when that wreck goes off my record and my insurance rates fall because of that and I'll be 7 months shy of 25, which is the next age bracket with lower rates.
 
lumberjack said:
They can be tied fine, but you'll kill the tensile strength of the rope, down to the point where it'd make more sense to just use a poly rope. They are also prone to creep due to it's slippery nature.
Click to expand...

Well...I've been using 1/2" Amsteel Blue strictly on crane removals lately. My crane guy used to have only steel cables to work with. And that was a pain... So, I provide my own. Super light and wicked strong. I use a bowline on the hook end of the crane. And I use a running bowline on the limb being taken away. With multiple ropes it is great to make spider leg lifts and watch them go away with less movement than one sling at a time.

According to Samson, the 1/2 Amsteel Blue is 34,000lbs (average breaking strength). http://www.samsonrope.com/index.cfm?ind=18&app=14&rope=192&inst=1

And according to research on knot breaking strength the bowline retains about 63-67% of the rope strength. http://www.caves.org/section/vertical/nh/50/knotrope.html

So, I figure my rope, at the knot, is now at 22,780lbs breaking strength. I'm plenty comfortable with that.

I paid $3.06/foot at Redden Marine Supply. Not bad. http://www.reddenmarine.com/site/new-detail.cfm?id=AMRAMSTLBLU12

I'm have (4) at 17' each. Because the rope is 6lbs per 100ft, my slings are about 1lb each. That's it! And believe me, it is worth the cost when this stuff is super easy to work with.

Oh. And the knot slippage stuff... Simply leave longer tails. And the bowline comes undone fast after being under load. 8)

Butch. You gotta try it. You'll wonder why you haven't used this sooner.
 
That's a good idea MB!

The Jeep is great for getting around town, but for highway journey's it wasn't as good as a car. The community college is 25 miles away, the university is twice that.
The fact that the Civic gets better than twice the milage did factor in, although now gas prices are back where they were when I bought the Jeep. This month I'll drive about 4500-4700 miles.

The only reason I didn't get a 2 door Accord was money. Insurance would have been a bitch.
 
I'll have some video footage with this in use soon. Stay tuned.;)
 
Jamin Mayer said:
Well...I've been using 1/2" Amsteel Blue strictly on crane removals lately. My crane guy used to have only steel cables to work with. And that was a pain... So, I provide my own. Super light and wicked strong. I use a bowline on the hook end of the crane. And I use a running bowline on the limb being taken away. With multiple ropes it is great to make spider leg lifts and watch them go away with less movement than one sling at a time.

According to Samson, the 1/2 Amsteel Blue is 34,000lbs (average breaking strength). http://www.samsonrope.com/index.cfm?ind=18&app=14&rope=192&inst=1

And according to research on knot breaking strength the bowline retains about 63-67% of the rope strength. http://www.caves.org/section/vertical/nh/50/knotrope.html

So, I figure my rope, at the knot, is now at 22,780lbs breaking strength. I'm plenty comfortable with that.

I paid $3.06/foot at Redden Marine Supply. Not bad. http://www.reddenmarine.com/site/new-detail.cfm?id=AMRAMSTLBLU12

I'm have (4) at 17' each. Because the rope is 6lbs per 100ft, my slings are about 1lb each. That's it! And believe me, it is worth the cost when this stuff is super easy to work with.

Oh. And the knot slippage stuff... Simply leave longer tails. And the bowline comes undone fast after being under load. 8)

Butch. You gotta try it. You'll wonder why you haven't used this sooner.
Click to expand...


You're dangerously wrong.

Intermingling unrelated statistics doesn't make new statistics.

Your bowline in 1/2" Amsteel is about as strong as (at most) 9/16-5/8" Stable braid with a running bowline. Probably closer to 1/2-9/16" Stable.

ETA: 60-70% reduction in strength using a bowline. When figuring in any dynamic aspect of the load, Amsteel can't mitigate the load by stretching, thus reducing it's perceived strength. Amsteel it cannot stretch to increase the time the force is applied to the rope (less peak loading) so it would be said that it couldn't handle shock as well. Under the same load with a "lessor" double braid line the rope would have a better chance at surviving as it stretches considerably under the added load, lowering the G loading, thus lowering the total load.
 
Correct, Carl.

Thus, if and when I go with some HMWPE slings, they'll be spliced. (I already have a 5/8th spectra sling for my big block, which seldom gets used.

My price for 1/2" Plasma was 1.80 a foot, may be up to 2.00 by now.....

same as Am-Blue
 
lumberjack said:
You're dangerously wrong..
Click to expand...


Where am I wrong? Is my math from the specs and research wrong? I sited my work. It is time you do so too Carl. Prove what you say please. Especially, if I am dangerously wrong. I don't want to kill someone because I'm not seeing something here.
 
Jamin, read the link you put up for strength loss in ropes.

Specifically read the construction of the ropes they tested.

Not trying to be cryptic. Instead of just telling you the answer, I'm trying to help you understand "why."
 
The ultra-high strength ropes have some limitations, the main one being that they don't handle knots very well. About the only way to take advantage of the high weight ratings is to use knotless terminations such as splices or some form of friction device like a porta-wrap. A bowline can reduce the strength in that cord enough to where you might as well be using Stable Braid. The ultra low stretch also means ultra low tolerance for shock loads.
So a small bounce on a knot could break the rope at a weight far below what you'd expect.
 
lumberjack said:
You're dangerously wrong.

Intermingling unrelated statistics doesn't make new statistics.

Your bowline in 1/2" Amsteel is about as strong as (at most) 9/16-5/8" Stable braid with a running bowline. Probably closer to 1/2-9/16" Stable.
Click to expand...

Carl. How was my information unrelated? The research for knots on rope is applicable to all type of ropes. The percentage of breaking strength doesn't vary on types of rope. The principle of loosing strength on rope would apply to all ropes.

How did you come up with your comparison of rope strengths? If I gave you 3/4" Stable braid, you still couldn't match the strength of the 1/2" Amsteel Blue with a running bowline.

3/4" Stable braid tensile strength is 20,400lbs.

If we were to put a running bowline on it it will come down to 13,668lbs.

I'm just researching the specs and doing the math. My conclusions are purely based on the logic of the arithmetic.

Can you and Roger please show me something I'm missing here?
 
Nearly all (and maybe all) high modulus lines require a bend radius roughly 2x it's poly counterpart. Knots are the rope bent over itself (1:1) whereas high mod lines like 8:1 or greater, although there is some wiggle room.

For lifting slings, Amsteel is great.

Just because they don't stretch doesn't mean they can't be used for some jobs where the block isn't above the load (think lowering limbs where the shock is from a swing, not a drop and stop). However, using amsteel to block down a trunk would be unwise, especially since it would melt.
 
I saw that the research was done on different type of rope. I don't think the principle differs greatly from rope to rope.

Does it?

Gosh. Where's Kenny when we need him? :|: I'm confused.
 
The ropes they use are poly and nylon, both class 1 (regular, non high mod) ropes.

Even still the construction of the rope, tightness of the braid, and how the knot is dressed can play a difference. Figure a bowline retains 70% of the strength of the normal poly rope. An exception is illustrated below.

Safety Pro 12 and Super Braid are rated at 6600lbs and 9100lbs (approx). Both are made from the same material. Safety Pro is normal and Super is crazy tight. Safety pro is stronger in a bowline than Super Braid.
 
lumberjack said:
Nearly all (and maybe all) high modulus lines require a bend radius roughly 2x it's poly counterpart. Knots are the rope bent over itself (1:1) whereas high mod lines like 8:1 or greater, although there is some wiggle room.

For lifting slings, Amsteel is great.

Just because they don't stretch doesn't mean they can't be used for some jobs where the block isn't above the load (think lowering limbs where the shock is from a swing, not a drop and stop). However, using amsteel to block down a trunk would be unwise, especially since it would melt.
Click to expand...

I totally understand running Amsteel on a porty or a GRCS would be bad news. I've seen the specs on the melting point. That's old info for me...

I'd just like to know where you found your information for what you are telling me. It seems good. But, I've never heard it before.
 
Amsteel rocks on a GRCS, provided you're lifting and you lower slowly. Still I'd like a poly covering to take the heat of lowering.

Look into bend radius. Poly ropes like 4:1 or greater (2" sheave for a 1/2" rope). High mod lines like 8:1 or greater.

I've developed my knowledge through years of rope love. Check out the 5th post of this thread. There's a plethora of ignorance about these "mysteriously strong" ropes.
 
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