Dead Trees -- Removal Job -- Critique Please

[rfwoody]

Beginning a new job that may take me several working days... remove 10 or so (mainly) dead trees and clean up (mainly Privet Hedges) underbrush.

First off --- THANK YOU Mr. Bernham and Sean, in particular -- and all/everybody else who I've learned from here.

Here are pictures of one tree I felled and one tree I broke off a dead limb from the main stem.
Left after this... planning to go back for more tomorrow.


Yellow line is direction of lay .... arrow got cut off when I uploaded picture.

















Mr. Burnham, I was hearing your helpful and motivating scorn from my previous thread
Sean, same here..... heart was racing because I was anxious about the dead tree.... didn't know how sturdy it would be.
Messed up first face cut .... but remembered advice... slowed down, etc. and cut a new one above the first one.

Also, Sean, I remember you talking about using throwline to pull down dead branches..... this one worked great! ... wasn't expecting it to break where it did but so much the better because of the shop it was leaning toward.

Do the fibers on the hinge tell anything about the deadness of the tree and condition of the wood there?

Hoping for unfiltered comments, scorn, advice, laughter, whatever.

Thanks for taking the time to look and comment.

 

[SkwerI]

Very dead trees. Hinge ability is minimal. Good thing you have the lean mostly in the right direction because those probably wouldn't follow a hinge too far out of the direction of the lean. Second tree should be easy to flop now that the part leaning toward the shed is gone. Lay it in the same place as the first one.

 

[Mellow]

Also, be aware that dead limbs may break off while you're cutting and when the tree starts to move. They're called "widow-makers."

 

[MasterBlaster]

 

[Jonny]

That's American Elm, right? Kinda surprised that piece broke off so easy for you, that stuff can stay pretty hard and stringy even when dead.

 

[flushcut]

The wood looks punky which is a from of rotten so they really aren't wood fibers any more, more like brittle foam. = 0 hinging ability be careful not to over tension when pulling while cutting. Leave a thick hinge and get out of dodge and pull from afar.

 

[rfwoody]

Thanks all for your comments and advice!!

haha, MB, I guess I'll take what intellect I can get!

Yes Johnny, no leaves, but that is what I'm thinking they are -- Elm ... but possibly, as you say, American Elm more precisely.

 

[MasterBlaster]

I'm pretty sure every one of us knows what a widow maker is.

 

[pantheraba]

Context and audience....if Rfwoody happened to be a cardiologist who is dabbling in tree cutting (likely, right???) his "everyone must know this" definition of widow-maker is:

from Google search....A widow maker is when you get a big blockage at the beginning of the left main artery or the left anterior descending artery (LAD).Apr 16, 2018

Basically a fatal heart attack. Mellow was just covering the bases.

 

[murphy4trees]

I'm pretty sure every one of us knows what a widow maker is.

Are there more people watching a thread like this than the regular contributors????? He may have been adding that for emphasis and certainly woody is still learning so it doesn't hurt to get clear...

It looks like elm and elm has really strong hinge fibers even when dead and peeling bark... the hinge fibers from that pic look like they held fairly well and that looks like a GREAT hinge for a rookie, so good to see you've been learning and the contributions have made a difference.

One suggestion would be to make sure the back cuts are level with or slightly above the level of the face cut.. Your back cut looks just a slight bit low, which worked here, but can make trees much harder to get moving, which can result in a hinge getting needlessly cut too thin and thereby losing some holding ability.. more of an issue with side leaners, but still good to dial in ....

Looks like the original face cut could have been saved by cleaning it up a bit, and no harm in re-cutting another face as long as its deeper than the abandoned face cut.

If it's elm that looks surprising to be able to break off that large a limb with the throw line.. I've rigged huge pieces off dead elm very reliably. Good way to go though..

SO THE REAL ? is.............................. How much $$$ did you put on the job? Hope you learned a bit about pricing too!


ps... that slight overcut in the top face would not be deep enough to be considered a dutchman... it's an acceptable face cut, though again you could have taken a moment to clean it up and even out the hinge fibers.. looks good!

 

[MasterBlaster]

He may have been adding that for emphasis and certainly woody is still learning so it doesn't hurt to get clear...

I'm sure that's what it was.

 

[stig]

Yep, if you frig your face cut up, easiest way out is to cut a new, deeper one.

A big plus is that nobody can tell from your photos that you didn't get it right first time.

I had just that situation with the new apprentice today.
Unintentional Dutchman..........cut a deeper face.

 

[rfwoody]

Yeah, thanks Stig, MB, and all... soaking it all in.

Yeah, thanks for the particularly careful attention to the hinge, Murphy.

I saw that afterwards my back cut was too low.... a bad habit I naturally do for some reason.
Your pointing it out will help keep it a focal point in my mind.

Yeah, the slight dutchman didn't seem to affect the hinge in this case, but I should have noticed it... was still too hurried because of concern over being close to the dead tree.

>>> Pricing <<<

The job is for a long time friend of mine and I am charging him $600.

The job was kind of sprawling... a lot of smaller stuff... so I was even more unsure what to charge.
Since it was for a friend I was more concerned about over charging vs. if in doubt, "over charge", and let the free-market/supply-demand sort things out.

* There is about 8 or 10 times more work to do.
* Spent about 4 hours already including travel time.
* The job is about 30 minutes away.
* Brush and wood can go in burn pile on his property.
* He is going to help some (e.g. on a pull line) on a couple of bigger trees and help carry stuff to the burn pile.

He was surprised at my "low" bid....
...and he sounded like he may give me more than that when he pays me, but either way is ok.

== The worse off the underbid is, the better I will remember the pain for the next bid!

 

[MasterBlaster]

Hopefully!!!

 

[murphy4trees]

OUCH!!!!

You're are hurting yourself more than you know... It's much easier to lower a high bid than raise a low bid... Job is probably worth $2K, maybe more... if you do tree owrk at half price, its a hobby... if you do it near 25% of the market cost, its INSANE!!!! This is HARD DANGEROUS work ... respect the trees and the work... gross underbidding is very damaging.. you can fix it though.. very easily..next time you are getting ready to give a price DOUBLE it!

 

[rfwoody]

ha, yeah, right, MB

yeah, thanks for the reminder, Murphy!

 

[Jonny]

I usually work pretty cheap for friends and family too.

 

[Mellow]

I'm sure that's what it was.

I was just trying to help. You, on the other hand, rarely pass up an opportunity to toss out a disparaging comment in my direction. What's up with that?

 

[MasterBlaster]

No worries.