Cone picking pics for Bounce

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Interesting thread. I have been involved with most of the cone collecting process, although climbing was not involved. It did involve a 12 gauge, a keen eye for good cones, a chainsaw and some very sticky fingers...

I've seen those tops so loaded with cones they break out under their own weight. You must have patients like no other. I can't imagine being tied off in the very tip top of a tree, picking cones one at a time and having everything you touch stick to your hands.
 
It pays well.
At least here it does.
I can be as patient as someone will pay me to be.
 
Bump.

Ok, revealing my ignorance of tree biology, what is it about the cones at the top of the tree that make them so special? I'm assuming that these conifers have cones all over the canopy, many of which are probably much lower and easier to access? So there must be some important, fundamental difference in the ones at the top? Thanks in advance to anyone who is able to enlighten me on this subject.

Tim
 
I also wanted to pull this post of Burnham's forward, as it is of primary importance to this thread. Just to save some possible new members of the forum some time if they're not inclined to read through this whole thread, like I just did. The whole thread is well worth reading, though, in my humble opinion, for those that are interested.

Tim

simplypete said:
I seem to remember you saying that you set an anchor then added protection as you went higher. That way if something broke out you only fell to your last piece of pro(tection). Similar to rock climbing. I don't remember the entire jist of the system but I am one that would like to hear again the way you do that.
Click to expand...

Burnham said:
Pete, you have the general picture accurately. The FS system for self-belay is called the "4-inch tie in". The idea is that there is a bole diameter in most western conifers that is pretty immune to breaking out from the effects of a climber above that point...i.e. 4 inches. That's your minimum diameter to consider a bomb proof anchor point. Some species, or in some conditions, you'd elect to go bigger, but never smaller.

So you climb by whatever combination of techniques is appropriate to that bole diameter. You have taken with you your 4-inch tie-in system...usually about 40 feet of 11mm fully dynamic climbing rope, about 6 slings, each with a triple action biner, and a prussik loop.

Under a whorl at +4 inch bole diameter, tie off one end of the belay rope around the stem, throw a prussik on it with the loop, and clip it into the center point of your saddle with a life support biner. Tie a good stopper knot on the other end of the belay rope. Advance the prussik 3 feet or so up the belay rope.

Climb no more than 3 feet, place a sling in a basket hitch above a whorl, and clip a tri-act biner into the legs of the sling and run the belay rope through the biner. Make sure you've advanced the prussik above the biner. Descending, never forget to bring the prussik down with you as you go, otherwise way too much slack developes for adequate protection.

The 3 foot figure keeps you from exposing yourself to a fall of over 6 feet, per OSHA.

Repeat until you run out of tree :). If you break the top out, you won't enjoy it, but you also won't hit the ground. I personally know of two real-life instances where the climbers insist that this system saved their lives when the tree top failed under them while picking cones.

Use a lanyard to assist positioning, and to free your hands to install and remove the self-belay protection points...but always remember that the lanyard does not protect you from a fall if you don't have the self belay in place and you break out the top you are lanyarded to. Once above the anchor point, never disconnect the belay system from your harness.

You can do a similar thing with your DRT system if you need to climb above your tie-in, but you need to rig a sling to keep your life line in it's crotch or on it's limb. Excess friction can build up pretty quickly as you add protection points, and make it much more difficult to work in than the 4-inch tie in, but it's a good trick to have in your bag.
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MasterBlaster said:
They are the newest???
Click to expand...

Yeah, Butch, that is an obvious truth. But you've probably hit the nail on the head. The fact that they are the newest might make it likely that they have a higher chance of producing the outcome the Forest Service is looking for.

I'd love to hear more background from Burnham about how the stuff that gets picked from the top of the trees ends up being employed. I thought I read somewhere, maybe in this thread, that the cones are not the only thing that gets harvested. Maybe it was some kind of grafting wood? I guess I'm starting to develop an interest in tree biology, after all this time. Better late than never, I guess. Up to now it's mostly been about how to keep from killing myself while trying to climb trees.

Thanks in advance to Burnham if he manages to see this thread and post his thoughts.

Tim
 
Ha! I guessed right!!!

Ew4GxPg.gif
 
As a part-time galavanter myself, I aspire to do it full time someday. I hope you’re out there living it up for us working stiffs Burn!
 
Tim_B. said:
I also wanted to pull this post of Burnham's forward, as it is of primary importance to this thread. Just to save some possible new members of the forum some time if they're not inclined to read through this whole thread, like I just did. The whole thread is well worth reading, though, in my humble opinion, for those that are interested.

Tim
Click to expand...



Tim_B. said:
Yeah, Butch, that is an obvious truth. But you've probably hit the nail on the head. The fact that they are the newest might make it likely that they have a higher chance of producing the outcome the Forest Service is looking for.

I'd love to hear more background from Burnham about how the stuff that gets picked from the top of the trees ends up being employed. I thought I read somewhere, maybe in this thread, that the cones are not the only thing that gets harvested. Maybe it was some kind of grafting wood? I guess I'm starting to develop an interest in tree biology, after all this time. Better late than never, I guess. Up to now it's mostly been about how to keep from killing myself while trying to climb trees.

Thanks in advance to Burnham if he manages to see this thread and post his thoughts.

Tim
Click to expand...

Tim, my friend, I'm sorry to have been so late in seeing these posts. And thanks much for bringing forward that post of mine describing the 4 inch tie-in. It's worth keeping in the available data for our cadre of new climbers. imo.

But here goes re your questions :):

Cones from the upper third or so of the crown are most likely to yield higher numbers of viable seeds per cone. That's because conifers are wind pollinated, and flowers on the upper branches are best exposed to wind carried pollen. Self pollination is a no go apparently, so pollen from other trees of the species must make it to the flowers of any one tree, and those upper areas of the crown are most likely to get good pollination.

And since the objective is for the cone picker to be most efficient in collecting viable seed, rather than just the largest number of cones, the tops are where we climb to and pick.

So then you have bushels and bushels of cones...what next? You have to pick cones green, before the seed is ripe, or the cones flare and the seed gets distributed as nature intended (again by wind) rather than ending up in my burlap bag...so you have to air dry the cones to ripeness once picked. That takes several weeks or a month on open racks with air movement from big electric fans and daily turning of the bags to get even drying/ripening. So we do that every morning before hitting the woods for that days' harvests. It's a 7 day a week schedule dawn to dusk when cones are being picked. Western conifers only bear decent sized crops on average every 5 or 7 years, so it's all out when a good year is upon you.

Then the cones go to a facility (usually a gov't one but there are some private businesses too) that extract the seed, cull for a high percentage of viable seed (verified by xrays) then packaged for frozen storage. Conifer seed stores very well this way, retaining high percentages of viability for at least a decade, often longer.

The seed is used to grow seedlings for reforestation planting. That process is quite complicated, too. If you want details, I can share some more info.

The other thing we climb up to the tops to harvest is grafting scion, as you recalled. That goes into seed orchards. Another really complicated procedure that I could address in detail if wished. Let me know if y'all are interested.
 
As for cone picking, when you are paid by the weight hired in by a private seed company, it is about getting the largest poundage a day, less about high seed content.
Being paid by the pound sure can turn you into an egoistic bastard.

I just found a video of the seed extraction process, called "Kl?ngning" in Danish.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/CN6c89kjKuU" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
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