Business Question

[arborworks1]

Agreed a mini should be standard treeguy kit nowadays.

 

[Fiddler]

Treesmith, some of what I'm spending came from roofing, so your not totally alone. I agree with the saving of cost of labor, it's a large part the reason for my own recent machinery investments.

I'm looking forward to my new mini arriving, scheduled for 1st or 2nd week in Feb.

 

[treesmith]

As to machinery, a ladder lift was the smartest investment I ever made in roofing, aside from the dump truck. I've already warped my back toting shingles.

What kind of mini did you get? And did you mean literally new, or like mine, "new to you"?

 

[Tucker943]

Payroll goes without saying. Thats not even worth comparing. There is tree work to be had, even in a bad economy. Again, that goes without saying. Im well aware that minis increase production. Ive been cleaning up tree jobs with machinery since i was 10 years old....skid steers, mini excavators, backhoes, knucklebooms, prentice booms blah blah blah...Ive cleaned up a job or 2, Im well versed on mechanical advantage.

Hey if you guys want to egg him on to take out a pile of loans and poke around for some work, go right ahead. Id rather encourage him to borrow money as the business calls out for it. To be honest, I think he would be wise to borrow some amount of money at start up, but not much.

 

[Fiddler]

What kind of mini did you get? And did you mean literally new, or like mine, "new to you"?

New Vermeer s650tx.

 

[lumberjack]

I couldn't care much less if he buys it or not. I offered to finance the machine for him and his monthly payment would cover an average 4.7 days of my fuel expense from last year. Clearly I'm not interested in selling it to him for the money.

If I would have bought a machine when I was his age instead of when I was 20, my financial situation would be a lot different, and I'm not complaining where I'm at currently one bit.

 

[MasterBlaster]

I'm not complaining where I'm at currently one bit.

Hahahahahaha, no shit!

 

[FJR]

I am all for more machines and less labor. You have a good head on your shoulders Adrian, I think you will do well.

 

[brendonv]

Yep!

 

[Tucker943]

I think he will blow other companies out of the water in due time. He knew more about tree work before he was out of high school then some guys do after decades on the job. Plus, he is ambitious, and that in my mind, will take him to the top in any line of work.

 

[greatoutdoors]

I am all for more machines and less labor. You have a good head on your shoulders Adrian, I think you will do well.

That's how I see it. I'll invest in equipment over labor whenever possible. Not only do I save my body, it's just too hard to find good, reliable workers. IMO, it's easier to find reliable equipment.

 

[arborworks1]

I'm not sure if this was mentioned, learnhow to turn wrenches on stuff. Keep good records on all your gear as well. When you decide to upgrade it will make selling it easier.

 

[HolmenTree]

I'm not sure if this was mentioned, learnhow to turn wrenches on stuff. Keep good records on all your gear as well. When you decide to upgrade it will make selling it easier.

That's the way I do it. When you maintain and wrench your own equipment you have a "built in ear" on how your operation is running. When you do it yourself you know what you got. I'm a self taught welder and mechanic, designed / built alot of my equipment in the off season.
Don't forget the chainsaws. Don't get caught in the trap of running half dull sawchain and throwing the loop away when it no longer cuts.
Good advice starting out is limit yourself to hiring one "good employee". That's how I started out, now that I have my business streamlined and things go like clockwork I have zero employees and work alone.

 

[rangerdanger]

Thanks guys!! Thats the main idea I'd like to build my business on is some great machines and one or two committed employees. Being able to do so much work with so few employees is the goal here, since, like a lot of you probably know, its tough to find good employees that actually want to be at a company and are not just there for the money. My ideal thing would be me and one other guy who is also a climber, so we could trade off on climbing duties.

As for maintaining my own equipment, I'd like to get into that a lot more and definitely learn how to do more of it. I have some mechanic friends who are going to help me out repairing Carl's machine when I get it, so hopefully I'll pick up a bunch from that. I'd also like to learn to weld at some point in the future, very useful skill to have I think.

 

[Tucker943]

That's the way I do it. When you maintain and wrench your own equipment you have a "built in ear" on how your operation is running. When you do it yourself you know what you got. I'm a self taught welder and mechanic, designed / built alot of my equipment in the off season.
Don't forget the chainsaws. Don't get caught in the trap of running half dull sawchain and throwing the loop away when it no longer cuts.
Good advice starting out is limit yourself to hiring one "good employee". That's how I started out, now that I have my business streamlined and things go like clockwork I have zero employees and work alone.

I think thats some spot on advice.I seem to think you run into less catastrophic breakdowns when you work on your own gear. You become so well versed on the ins and outs of the gear that you pick up on issues and potential failures very quickly before they turn into disasters.

As far as good employees RD..... be prepared to be the bad guy. I think finding a good right hand man to start out is a key maneuver also. That can sometimes be a tough thing to find. I have been through a number of guys over the last bunch of years. At first, I hated having to fire someone. It made me as uncomfortable as it made them. I still dont get like it. My fathers brother has been president and/or chief operating officer for 2 Fortune 500 companies and once in awhile I have gone to him for advice. Regarding firing guys, here is something he said that I hope to always remember. "The day you dont have it in you to fire someone, your business is in big trouble. The day you start to enjoy firing people, your business is in big trouble".....

 

[Burnham]

That last bit, from your uncle, is absolutely worth it's weight in gold, Tuck.

 

[rangerdanger]

Thanks for the advice Tuck, and yeah, I agree with most of it. I've gotten on Dad's case a few times about firing guys, its tough sometimes.

Thinking as of right now I may just begin to take over Dad's business. He's been having a lot of trouble the past few weeks keeping up with the physical side of it all, so it'd be nice to phase him into more sales while I take over most of the climbing and operations. Mom doesn't like the business at all, and she's mentioned about selling/giving me her share of the company(roughly 50%), and over time I'd like to buy Dad out and have him do sales and consulting for the most part, because that's what he's great at, along with small tree pruning.

 

[arborworks1]

That would be a great move.

 

[NickfromWI]

I never understood why you were considering your own company in the first place. It seems like you and your dad work well together. You might as well take advantage of that and use it to build something phenomenal. Two good things together will do a LOT more than the sum of what they could do individually.

 

[rangerdanger]

Yeah man, for the most part we get along, its just that we don't see eye to eye on some things, thats the main reason why I was considering my own. I've talked to some other guys who were in a similar boat and grew up working for their Dad's company and ended up starting their own because they didn't see eye to eye with a lot of things with their fathers. But I figure we can get over most of the stuff we disagree on, especially since he's moving to more sales and consulting, so we won't be arguing and disagreeing much more on the job site.

 

[NickfromWI]

In my opinion, you guys need to square away who is making the judgement calls on the job site. There shouldn't be anything to disagree with on the jobsite. Let the leader lead. Talk about it later. Make changes as needed. If you always duke it out on the jobsite, you'll never have a good rhythm. The situation will be in charge.

Who ever is the 2nd man on the totem pole needs to be ready to let the leader make mistakes.

 

[bonner1040]

Who ever is the 2nd man on the totem pole needs to be ready to let the leader make mistakes.

 

[rangerdanger]

Exactly Nick, and thats what I'm trying too better establish with us. Normally how these disagreements come about is Dad is on site for a few, than leaves to do some bids, run errands, etc, leaving me in charge. Then when he comes back he tries to start doing things his way again, and thats where disagreements start to happen. Trying to get it where I'm calling the shots on the job now, in regards to how it gets done etc, and all he does is show us the work order or shows us what to do, and I take it from there.

 

[Tucker943]

Family and work can be a tough mix. I always admired the families that work together seamlessly. It takes a special type.

 

[treesandsurf]

great thread! I made the mistake of buying older equipment and paid for it dearly. Lot of down time, tow fees, mechanic bills. Scrapped all the shitty stuff, sold it for what I could and financed better equipment. Even with the financing I can pay off the monthly payment on all my equipment on one good day a month of work. Plus I realized that the small time equipment was costing me money in frequent dump runs, paying guys to stand around etc. Definitely a learning curve!

There's a lot of good advice hear from seasoned pros that have been doing it a while. Hopefully you can find a good niche with your family co. that works well for everyone. Good luck Adrian whatever you do you'll do great!

jp