441

[Al Smith]

I have seen many a saw that has been ran hard with the entire muffler intact.Most of them have had the front of the pistons cooked .

You don't neccessarily have to gut the muffler but an extra hole certainly does help . Then too ,more than likely this would void the warentee on a new saw .

That engine has to be able to breathe if it is to run properly. Being a 2 cycle,it can't get in if it can't get out .

 

[wiley_p]

For what it's worth, there is absolutely nothing that is as hard on a chainsaw as PCT work...nothing. Perhaps under less demanding conditions, the overheating may not be so much of an issue. Or if you do a decent muffler mod to help the heat get away.[/QUOTE]

Burnham, I would be willing to argue that, cutting line in heavy Manzanita, in summer is harder than thinning. Granted I have only done thinning in the cooler months. I'm inclined to think the harder wood, and higher air temps make it harder on the saw.

 

[Reddog]

Well the first thing I would question on any 441 failure is, how was it tuned?
You can not I repeat CAN NOT tune this saw by ear.
If you buy one and want it to last, buy a tach and use it.

As for the muffler mod. Haven't done mine yet. Maybe this summer I will look at it. But it cuts fine right now.

 

[Burnham]

Burnham, I would be willing to argue that, cutting line in heavy Manzanita, in summer is harder than thinning. Granted I have only done thinning in the cooler months. I'm inclined to think the harder wood, and higher air temps make it harder on the saw.

I will cede the point to you, Dave. You are quite probably correct. While we do PCT work in summer here on the Mt. Hood, the temps are generally not as high as is often the case down in that Cali manzanita country.

 

[Burnham]

Well the first thing I would question on any 441 failure is, how was it tuned?
You can not I repeat CAN NOT tune this saw by ear.
If you buy one and want it to last, buy a tach and use it.

As for the muffler mod. Haven't done mine yet. Maybe this summer I will look at it. But it cuts fine right now.

In this case the saws were initially tuned by a Stihl tech...brand new saws failing within several days of purchase. It is of course quite possible that an operator tried to tweak it in the field, I don't know. But I do know that this same tech acknowleged that he had taken several other 441's back in with the same issue. So who knows...but I doubt anyone can argue against the case that these modern saws labor under such strict emmission limits that they are running mighty hot in stock form.

 

[SkwerI]

Not a good tech. He's tuning them too lean, following strict 'by the book' numbers without allowing any variance for temp or elevation changes. He tuned them on the razor's edge and then acted surprised when they failed. This is why I don't blindly trust 'Stihl Techs' just because they work at a saw dealership and got a piece of paper from Stihl.

 

[Greenhorn]

So I ran my "almost" new 360 beside my 361 today and potentially understand the difference in the 440/441. The 361 is SO much smoother and makes a bit more power - have worked on the muffler a bit though. Anyways - I'm all for less vibration if you're using the thing all day. I wanna 661!! Am trying to find a 385XP though, I hear its the shizzle for your money.

 

[squisher]

Get a 660 you won't be dissapointed. Although I still keep coming back to my good ole 046's I dunno if it's just habit but that's the saw that seems to come out of the box more than the others.

 

[arborworks1]

I will second Squish, the 660 is a great saw. I was using a full comp 42inch on one last week. Pulled quite nice(the saw shop was out of skip what you gonna do)

 

[lumberjack]

I suppose if I could only have one rear handled saw, it'd be a 460.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Great for cutting firewood.

 

[squisher]

I was using a full comp 42inch on one last week. Pulled quite nice(the saw shop was out of skip what you gonna do)

Alot of filing.

 

[squisher]

Great for cutting firewood.

Great for cutting. It's a awesome saw up to a 24" bar imo. After that a little lacking I find.

 

[Burnham]

Brian, you are being inconsistant here, brother. First you say this:

Burnham, I think you're dead on with the heat/ muffler modding suggestion. And that will be a factor on ALL new saws. My newest Husky 346XP has a catalytic converter muffler, for Pete's sake! It ran scary hot when I first got it, so hot that the factory put heat reflecting tape on the bottom of the front hand guard (chain brake lever). I was afraid to really use it more than 10 minutes before draining it, boxing it up and shipping it off to get modded. No way in Hell would that saw hold up in stock form.

Then when I answer Reddog with this post,

In this case the saws were initially tuned by a Stihl tech...brand new saws failing within several days of purchase. It is of course quite possible that an operator tried to tweak it in the field, I don't know. But I do know that this same tech acknowleged that he had taken several other 441's back in with the same issue. So who knows...but I doubt anyone can argue against the case that these modern saws labor under such strict emmission limits that they are running mighty hot in stock form.

you have this to say:

Not a good tech. He's tuning them too lean, following strict 'by the book' numbers without allowing any variance for temp or elevation changes. He tuned them on the razor's edge and then acted surprised when they failed. This is why I don't blindly trust 'Stihl Techs' just because they work at a saw dealership and got a piece of paper from Stihl.

So make up your mind . Which is it? These new saws can't be run in stock form and hold up no matter what is done to it short of modding, or the tech is at fault for mis-tuning, nothing wrong with the way the manufacturer designed and set the saw up?