22" Stihl bar for my 461

  • Thread starter Thread starter Bermy
  • Start date Start date
  • Replies Replies 29
  • Views Views 6K
Bermy

Bermy

Acolyte of the short bar
Joined
May 3, 2008
Messages
8,672
Location
Tasmania
I was chatting to a friend of mine about prices for bars and such, trying to get a feel for how much I should expect to pay for a 25" bar for the 461...he went diving in his shed and gave me an old 22" Stihl bar and chain, he said it was a test item they sent out to him a while back...he doesn't use it any more, still in pretty good nick.
Also said if you really need a wee bit more length, in a pinch, take off the felling dogs, you'll get an extra inch or so just to finish something.
 
Normally that's a Husqvarna large mount bar made by Windsor, I have one for my 372XP and love the 22" size but have since gone to 24" on the 372 and 18-20" on the 562.
The 22" is a nice match for a MS461 if that is your only main saw, just keep a 28" or 32" for a quick swap for bigger timber, and a 18" for small stuff.
 
I think just as general conversation that prefered bar lengths must be a regional thing .Locally that would be 20" ,24" ,32" and 36".You don't see many 18" or 28" in use .16" generally only used on smaller firewood saws .
 
In our region tree length pulp cutting with a 18" -60-70cc saw works the best. Just enough reach for the average operator for limbing and topping.
Late 1960s early 1970s when a lot of the short Frenchmen came from Quebec to log here they all ran 16". And man could those guys make high production on our piecework system with cut and skid.
The local farmers who once were our majority of loggers had to re think how they cut timber when the Frenchmen doubled them in production.
I remember young French guys going into town and buying brand new Pontiac Trans Ams paid by cash and driving them back into the bush camp. All different colored ones lined up along the bunkhouses.
:)
 
Consider an 8 pin sprocket for that sized bar, species dependent.

My experience is with a hopped up 460, dual port muffler. It does well with the 8 pin 28", and screams through 20" bar material.
 
I'd stick with the 7 pin, I hear those hardwoods down under are tough going. Plus the extra chain speed is going to jeopardize threshold chain rating of most chaps and safety trousers, unless 4100 rated pads are used.
 
 
That is interesting about chap ratings, Willard. I would have thought that if you were going to stick your revolving chain into your chaps, lower torque over lesser chain speed would be preferred. You seem to be saying the opposite.
 
Oh Lawdy I only wear chaps when running at competition .One thing I never want to try to find out is if they will stop a chain no matter if it's a slow gear drive or a hot saw .
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #11
Stig mentioned changing to an 8 pin as well...just for crosscutting and delimbing I could see that, but in my mind I'm thinking of the days I'm going to borecut...I've had a 361 knock me on my butt with kickback getting the bore not quite right, so I'm triple cautious about how I'm going to fare with this new setup. I hear you Willard!
And yes, blackwood and euc are pretty hard.
My pal is a renowned chainsaw carver...his shed is full of bars and chains and saws, I think he must have been sponsored by Stihl, that's how he had the 22"...I learn something new every time we chat, he used to be a faller too, so he's got loads of experience to share. Over here the 22" never caught on apparently.

My camera has died, so no pics unfortunately
 
woodworkingboy said:
That is interesting about chap ratings, Willard. I would have thought that if you were going to stick your revolving chain into your chaps, lower torque over lesser chain speed would be preferred. You seem to be saying the opposite.
Click to expand...
A 8 pin drive sprocket has more chainspeed and less torque then the smaller diameter 7 pin.:?
 
SouthSoundTree said:
Consider an 8 pin sprocket for that sized bar, species dependent.

My experience is with a hopped up 460, dual port muffler. It does well with the 8 pin 28", and screams through 20" bar material.
Click to expand...

HolmenTree said:
I'd stick with the 7 pin, I hear those hardwoods down under are tough going. Plus the extra chain speed is going to jeopardize threshold chain rating of most chaps and safety trousers, unless 4100 rated pads are used.
Click to expand...
Ok Ok Jay I guess you didn't read the whole story , I was answering without quote to SouthSound Tree.
 
Well fair kind small lady even at over 200 pounds a bore cut that gets awry can kick my butt too .The good thing if there is one is it's coming straight back on you --usually
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #16
Al Smith said:
Well fair kind small lady even at over 200 pounds a bore cut that gets awry can kick my butt too .The good thing if there is one is it's coming straight back on you --usually
Click to expand...

Yup...'ooff'...is generally the sound one makes...
 
Just another FYI, chaps are not rated for electric chainsaws either, something about the torque they produce as near as I recall?
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #18
I heard that too. I'd still wear them though.
 
Fi, do you have a good foundation on bore cutting? I hate hearing of bore cuts jumping at people. Ive had it happen a bit when teaching myself how. When I took to working as a logger for a period in life, the boss showed me how to do it in a smooth and seamless sequence of movements, and since that day it was always a smooth controlled cut for me. Before that though.....
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #20
Yes I do thanks for the concern! taught well by some very good tutors, and had to pass a practical, but as you know, sometimes you just don't get the swivel inside the tree at the start of the cut just right, especially in hard wood and oopsie...but in always anticipating the possibility of a kickback, when it happens you can walk away. I do a fair bit of it, but up to now, smaller powered saws. Gutting hinges, felling with a small bar, and head leaners.
Casuarina has been the wood to get me, with a non-safety chain, stuff is HARD.
My issue is height and weight, I don't have much of each so position is crucial!
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #21
...that's not to say I don't have more to learn! What I call 'a fair bit' is probably what some of you guys would do in a couple days!
 
I didn't mean it in a rude way. I genuinely didn't know what your bore cutting experience level was.
 
Willard, as I mentioned, species dependent.

Perhaps there are nuances (strike that), there are surely nuances that I miss. Seems chainspeed is good for short length cuts, like limbing, where you don't bog the saw down. If the saw is not bogged down while bucking, is the lesser torque significant? If it was cutting bar length cants, I bet the the torque would matter more, as the whole time the bar is max deep, so to speak, whereas when crosscutting a 20" log, on average you'd be cutting only 10" of wood, it seems to me (seems there might be a less straightforward truth to the number, but 10" is at least a reasonable guess).

Here, we are generally softwood and softer hardwood. Was bucking with the 460/ 28"/ 8 pin today. I wonder if I timed 7 pin versus 8 pin, what would I find.

Leg protection is an important component. I didn't know about the chainspeed rating. I hope to never find out by accident if my chaps/ pants will stop a chain. Knock wood. Personally, cutting my legs is one of the lesser of the dangers for me doing hazard removals and non-bush felling/ limbing. I put chaps on today as I knew it was a much higher risk situation that most days, still very manageable, but better safe than sorry. Had to limb some felled, wolfy firs.
 
SouthSoundTree said:
Willard, as I mentioned, species dependent.

Perhaps there are nuances (strike that), there are surely nuances that I miss. Seems chainspeed is good for short length cuts, like limbing, where you don't bog the saw down. If the saw is not bogged down while bucking, is the lesser torque significant? If it was cutting bar length cants, I bet the the torque would matter more, as the whole time the bar is max deep, so to speak, whereas when crosscutting a 20" log, on average you'd be cutting only 10" of wood, it seems to me (seems there might be a less straightforward truth to the number, but 10" is at least a reasonable guess).

Here, we are generally softwood and softer hardwood. Was bucking with the 460/ 28"/ 8 pin today. I wonder if I timed 7 pin versus 8 pin, what would I find.

Leg protection is an important component. I didn't know about the chainspeed rating. I hope to never find out by accident if my chaps/ pants will stop a chain. Knock wood. Personally, cutting my legs is one of the lesser of the dangers for me doing hazard removals and non-bush felling/ limbing. I put chaps on today as I knew it was a much higher risk situation that most days, still very manageable, but better safe than sorry. Had to limb some felled, wolfy firs.
Click to expand...
Sean, yes tree species is dependent but so is operator species dependent too.;)
Let's take Bermy for example she's approx. 110 lb- 5' 2" tall, she is using a saw[Stihl 461] that is about maximum saw she will need and comfortably operate. Now remember Cold Logging's argument that he has had millions of kickbacks with a MS660- 36" even one handed and he always came out of it safely.......well the man is 285 lbs what can be expected?!!!!!

Logging 8hr a day in a general tree species and size calls for a certain size rim sprocket. Arb work many different species, sizes and more dirty conditions are encountered, a 7 pin rim is a good choice for a bone stock 461. From my timbersport experiences in timed cuts between a 7 pin and 8 pin rim in 10"X10" green spruce [sometimes frozen] is with my Stihl 064- 16" b/c with round filed chain, cutters filed half back, depth gauges .015-.020, the 7 pin will always cut faster.
Don't forget more chainspeed will dull a chain faster and rock out more cutters when contacting a rock or metal in the tree. In dirt more chainspeed makes more abrasion on the cutters chrome. Rotational and pinch kickback energy is greater with more chainspeed . Protective pad ratings are exceeded more.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

treesmith
New saws
2
Replies
29
Views
735
Kaveman
Kaveman
BlackBikeDave
MS201 Storage Case
Replies
5
Views
255
lxskllr
lxskllr
Cobleskill
Blast From The Past
Replies
2
Views
362
BlackSmith
BlackSmith
Burnham
My father's axe
2 3 4
Replies
91
Views
3K
cory
cory
Knotorious
Stop Using "Double Fisherman's Knot" to Refer to the "Poacher's Knot" AKA "Double Overhand Noose!"
2
Replies
30
Views
2K
SeanKroll
SeanKroll
Back
Top