How long do your saws last?

[Page]

I don’t work on my saws (yet) . I take them to a local saw shop but I’m beginning to get aggravated with them. It seems like saws last about 2 years before I end up putting so much money into them ( and lost time) that it’s more worth it to just buy a new saw. I’ve talked to several other company owners in my area that say the same thing and that they pretty much have their saws on a constant rotation. Buy new, run for 2 years, then sell and buy new again.
What is your experience?

 

[flushcut]

I have some saw that are 15 years old. My 3120 bought used is from 98. Air/fuel filters and the occasional fuel line is about all I have ever done. I've had two saw that needed new carbs. Burned up a high hour 372 bought used and I ran the hell out of it for five years.


What's going on with the saw?

 

[stig]

2 years of full time logging is a good figure.

Last year we cut for 7 months, 8 hours a day.

I DON'T work on saws. I can make way better money per hour by running them.

When they start to fail, we dump them with no regrets.

Compared to the rest of the costs, saws are not expensive.

Last year, when we switched from MS441 to MS 462 and turned from MS260 to MS241, we bought 10 saws.

But at the same time we used 3000 liter of alkylate fuel at 3.40$ a liter and 600 liters of chain lube at 3.9$ a liter.
Add the chains and bars and the saws will seem like a small amount.

Normally we don't spend near that much on saws, changing over from two models to new ones brought it up so high.

Plus of course the one idiot who had one stolen and parked a large Beech tree on another one.

 

[MasterBlaster]

It seems to me you should be getting more time outta those saws, Page.

 

[Mick!]

Depends on the saws i guess, toppers and mid range=short life expectancy, especially if you’re cutting up rings for handballing.

 

[Magnus]

Most pro's here change every year mid range saw. The smaller and big gun 2-3 depending on hrs on them.

I usually say if its a moneymaker and cost exceed 40% of new price its not worth the risk.
If you have one saw like many do its just as well to change every year.

 

[SeanKroll]

How many employees run them? How many are professionals, and how many run of the mill groundie laborers?

Employees, all bets off.

Cycle through them before problems start, if this is your experience.

Warm them up a hair, keep the from overheating... Clean fins and no chaps/ pants blocking the air intake on the starter cover.

 

[stig]

What is a mid range saw to you, Magnus.

Coming from primarily hardwood logging, a 70 cc is mid range to me.

Those are the ones we put the hours on.

The MS880 will most likely outlast me unless I drop a tree on it.

That one hangs in the shop and only comes out when we need some serious grunt.

The picture is the last cuts made by the 661, before I drove home and got the 880 out of the shop ( 3 hours drive and well worth it, as we had a bunch of trees like that to fell)

 

[stig]

Sean, in my outfit there is no difference between employees and owners when it comes to saws.

We all run the best money can buy.

Want somebody to make money for you in logging.
Give him/her the tools to do so.

Apprentices are a different thing.
They are notoriously hard on saws, so they get used ones.

Which is why, giving our present one a new MS462 was our way of saying that we feel he is doing good.

 

[SeanKroll]

You bought the 462 for a pro-caliber trainee, not a stick pickerupper raker laborer guy.


You start with top-candidates.

 

[MasterBlaster]

As Sean said, there are a lotta variables involved in the equation. Like my buddy Mike - he works about every day but his saws last several years.

 

[pete mctree]

I get 5 years plus out of most saws doing arborist work ( climbing saws about 2 years before a rebuild). I do 90% of the work on them myself which makes keeping them so long viable. My logging saw however, is sold and replaced every 2 years as it needs to be completed reliable and strong.

 

[Stumpshot]

We're more in line with what Pete is saying. Most minor repairs on climbing saws (top handle shockmounts, fuel tanks, mufflers, etc.) are done in house. Carb issues or undiagnosable issues go off to the repair shop. I'm off to the shop now to rebuild the shaft in our HT-133 power pruner. No issues with our larger saws (Husqy 395XP, Stihl 880). Meanwhile, the 346 is toast after 2-3 years so we replaced it with 2 x 550XPs. In hindsight, the rebuild on the 372XP wasn't worth it at $600. We would've been better off picking up a 461 or equivalent Stihl, or simply buying another 372. So I'd agree that the cost of repair on the mid-range 70cc class saws isn't going to be worth it. They're worked hard and do a bunch of the heavy grunt work (bucking, limbing, felling), so best to have something guaranteed reliable.

 

[SkwerI]

I can't remember the last time I wore out the engine in a saw. I use synthetic mix oil though. I run saws until they fall apart. The cases and screw holes stripping out, etc.

I bought a half dozen 200T top handles back when Stihl quit making them and I'm still running 5 of them. I keep two on each bucket truck and my groundman has one on the chip truck.

I've bought 6 MS150 top handles in the last 4 years, only 2 are still running. Those got busted up from dropping them, mostly. Way too many issues, I won't buy another.

Mid size and large saws I own enough that no one saw gets a ton of hours. I do work on them as needed. Easy enough to throw a saw in the shop when it messes up and look at it on the weekend or evening when I'm bored. Again, I have enough saws that there are plenty of spares and no one saw is critical to being able to work.

Over half of my saws are over 10 years old, a few are pushing 15 years old. If you keep up on the small issues as they occur then it's easier to keep using the saw instead of replacing it. If you let several minor issues add up then one day you get fed up and junk it instead of fixing a dozen problems at once. You just say it's worn out and buy a new one.

 

[Stumpshot]

With the way taxes work, it's feasible to feed in new saw purchases and write them off for business expenses. So no need to prop up something that becomes a time & money sinkhole.

 

[treebilly]

Page I feel my top handles don’t owe me a thing if I get two years out of them. If you consider a 461 midrange, I’m getting maybe two years before they are toast. We run the shit out of them though. My 661 can go weeks without being touched. Right now we’re burning 2&1/2 gallons of gas between 2 461’s daily (10-12 hours). Air filters get tapped out after every tank of fuel and saws get tore apart and hit with the air compressor weekly. At the pace we’re on I’m hoping they last a year. Saws used to last longer from memory but my work practices have changed drastically. If you’re gonna buy a new saw I would drop the extra hundred and upgrade to a 462. Well worth it. I just became the first in my county to own one. The dealer isn’t stocking them yet as they want to sell off their inventory of 461’s first. They did me a favor. Instantly can notice the weight difference. And the power is holy unbelievable for its size. Stig’s review is why I waited on the 462 over the 461. He was right. I just cut a bit of firewood at home with it and can feel the difference. Against my better judgement I’m taking it to work Monday to do some felling. I have no doubt it will continue to impress me.

 

[Magnus]

What is a mid range saw to you, Magnus.

Most here run 60-65cc as mid range saw and 80-90cc as big.
I agree mid range is 55-75cc.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

As to the original question, that depends

 

[Altissimus]

Exactly like Skis ... When I joined Ski Patrol and got some "free" new boards that went immediately into hard pro use , people I worked with said " you bought them to use them". Even taking extra good care after two maybe three years they just don't respond the same. I figure three years for saws with big use , usually hit a point where it's constantly breaking by then ... Use it for $100 towards next new one. ... Edit , I do rebuild the saws I like that aren't available anymore

 

[Page]

My 395 has been with me for 5 years with minimal issue. The husky climber was a joke and was broke from the get go. 2 562’s that are killer saws when they run but spend a lot of time in the shop. I have 3 201’s and 1 is almost always in the shop. And I have a stihl 446 that we call so so stilh. It always runs just ok. I tried buying only good gas for the longest time but it made no apparent difference. Small crew, just 4 of us and saws run mostly by 2 of us. I’ve tried scheduling regular maintenance but these things just seem to have a lifespan. I do a lot of cutting. Sometimes I feel more like a logger than an arborist

 

[Page]

Maybe that’s not the right comparison. Loggers can be arborists, and arborists can do a lotta cutting as well. I just mean that I take down a lot of trees and do a lot of cutting for a small company.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Damn straight!!!

 

[SeanKroll]

What kind of breakdowns?

Lean seizures?
Motor mounts?
Stripped spark plug holes?
Stripped other-bolt holes?
Carb issues?
Seals?
Premature failure of bigger parts like tanks or covers?

Candle that burns twice as bright burns half as long.

If you're bucking a Lot, maybe have a monster, ported bucking saw that chews right through it, with the right variety of bars. Big saws are heavy enough without unnecessarily big bars.

 

[Page]

I’ve certainly had all those problems. I guess I just thought that for the price they would last longer but it seems as though a lot of people are seeing the same thing. Such is the never ending costs of the business owner.

 

[Bermy]

Mine last FO-EVAH...pretty much.
I don't have the hrs on mine that you lot do though.
Even the 020t I found in de bushes 20 yrs ago is still working (new carb, new chainbrake)
Across the range of my saws 021, 150, 020, 200, 260, 361, 462 I have:
One carb
3 tank breathers
Two shut off wires
Two chainbrake bands
three clutchside inner covers (200 range)
Various and sundry sprockets and bars
All my own maintenance so far.