Macrocarpas and deadwood

[Bermy]

I get to work on quite a lot of macrocarpas now...usually long branches have collapsed under their weight.
Up in the canopy is usually a LOT of deadwood as the interiors are so shaded.

What's your opinon on a good deadwood cleanout...I could take out a LOT and the interior would be much more open. This would be in addition to some endweight reduction and a bit of thinning.

Obviously the wind would be able to pass through more easily...but would taking out most of the dead stuff compromise some of the structure, there is that much in some of them that have been left for years, that I do wonder if it isn't contributing to stability sometimes.

The latest ones I have to do are about 50' tall x40/50' wide on the edge of a garden

 

[Bodean]

Sometimes I think the complete removal of dw is a negative.
Torsion is the tenth of bending required to break limbs.
I think sometimes taking out too much dw allows the heavy green limbs to spin and oscillate.

Also, I think a certain amount of small fuzz dw protects from the wind and sun scald.

 

[Bermy]

Fair enough...on some macrocarpas, taking all the dead wood would be akin to liontailing.

On some, they have been left for so long that the branches are way long and skinny trying to get out from under all the deadwood above and all they've got is a bit of green at the ends.

So will macrocarpas sprout at all back on the old wood if more light is let in? What's the situation with dormant buds if any?

 

[Bodean]

I'm assuming Ficus Macrocarpa.

They have latent buds that sprout.

 

[Thor's Hammer]

Cuppressus macrocarpa?

We used to do hundreds, being a coastal location. We noticed that the first good wind after a thorough deadwooding, would tear branches off all over the deadwooded trees, but not the untouched ones.

 

[Koala]

Sometimes I think the complete removal of dw is a negative.
Torsion is the tenth of bending required to break limbs.
I think sometimes taking out too much dw allows the heavy green limbs to spin and oscillate.

Also, I think a certain amount of small fuzz dw protects from the wind and sun scald.

I agree. It happens here on Pinus pinea.
Removing too much dw can interfere with the "self-stabilisation" process of the tree, increasing the risk of branches breaking due to wind or snow.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Deadwood = wind dampening

 

[Koala]

You 're right MB.
Like Bodean was saying heavy green limbs can oscillate more and be exposed to a higher risk of breaking.
Not talking about removing little dried twigs.

Here's a small one I recently did. Any criticism is welcome.

 

[DMc]

...on some macrocarpas, taking all the dead wood would be akin to liontailing...

Bermy, could you narrow it down a bit? Which genus?

As others have noted, trees that have a growth pattern of tight or intertwining limbs, even if dead limbs, will grow with a dependency on the support they provide. So structural awareness and caution are necessary.

Dave

 

[Bermy]

Cupressus macrocarpa.

I'm talking about the abundance of small 1" and less size twigs that block your way up to a good TIP, in order to get to those limbs that have broken because they have grown out so long to get to any sunlight.
I do understand about leaving dead or even crossing branches that have become important for support of those above them...that's the 'exception' factor for pruning and deadwooding where you have to judge what's going on in the whole tree, not just the immediate locality.
So if trying to in a way renovate a neglected tree, after taking care of the busted branches and hangars, will considerd and jusdicious removal of deadwood allow, with the increasd light penetration, any dormant buds to break out...? Not being all that familiar with these specific trees, but getting to know them quickly!

 

[Porkbrick]

we get pretty thorough when deadwooding cypress here (sometimes more thorough than i am comfortable with, but im just an employee). imo removing small deadwood and dead/broken limbs not supporting other limbs is not a problem. granted, some trees have sooo much deadwood that its impossible to tell what is supported by what. we almost never just deadwood however, we thin and when we do we thin the ends of the branches with a particular focus on reducing endweight on those long weak branches. as far as i know there hasnt been a macrocarpa that we pruned that has had a major limb failure afterwards (i say major cause as heavy as we tend to prune, some smaller branches oftentimes break after storms and such).

in the pic you can see the left half is yet to be pruned. not the greatest illustration, but its all ive got on the puter at the moment.

 

[Bodean]

Cupressus macrocarpa is what i deal with everyday with Euc's and Pines.
The cypress does not sprout latent buds.

Everything is at the ends of the limb.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

The varieties in NZ sound intriguing. You have any pics of what you are working with Fiona?

 

[Bermy]

I'm actually in Tasmania right now...
This first pic is one I had to cut the broken branches out of, the second one I is just one I saw on a visit, pretty extreme!
I'll get more when the occasion arises.

Generally the ones I work on were planted to line the avenue approaching a 'stately home' or the homestead on a large station, they have grown large and thick and intertwined, have become shaded by each other and adjacent trees...lots of green on the outside and consequently loads of interior deadwood and long wibbly branches or broken ones. They are sometimes upwards of 80-100 yrs and its rare if anyone has done any formative work on them, usually just walloped off the long ends when they got too long over the driveway.

The ones planted out in the paddocks for windbreaks take their licks where they are, no-one bothers much about them.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Just my opinion Fiona. When I run into situations like that with some types of shrubs and trees we have here, most have never been touched or as you say, walloped the tips off of when they get in the way. I the plan I often make with the home owner is a more gradual pruning in steps over time. Start with the most obvious and work in from there. Every couple of years I take a little more, watching how mother nature is also sorting it out. Taking all the dead wood off a manzanita per se, here, often leads to losses or larger limbs from snow load or high winds if they are tall enough and exposed enough. Conservative pruning and dead wooding seems to be the way to go over time. May not sell well, but when it does, nothing wrong with a long term client. And if you explain it to the client exactly what can happen when you take too much, they often understand.

 

[Bermy]

Yup, sound advice, thanks!

I tell people I can always take more off, but I can't put it back once its gone, I tell them lets take a bit now, let the tree recover and adjust then do some more...the rational explainations do seem to get through with most people.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Yeah.... Gorilla Glue can only do so much

 

[Bermy]

Duct tape...

 

[Old Monkey]

I number the branches I cut off just in case.

Interesting topic. I used to prune a lot of those when I lived in the Bay Area. They're interesting in a lot of ways. They'd look pretty good from the ground and then I'd climb them to find most of the large branches developing splits along the top and starting to splay open. One branch would get too heavy, split open and settle down on the branch below it, making it to heavy and starting it splitting too. It was a mess. If you removed all the splitting branches, there'd be nothing left. If you took end weight off you'd separate them from the branch below and leave them subject to the wind. They were a puzzle to me. Next time I head back home I should check some of the ones I did at Ft. Baker by the Golden Gate Bridge and see how my choices faired.

I did a fine deadwood of my Mother in Law's catalpa and it had some large breakage afterward. I think those trees do better with their dead and their inter tangled branches.

 

[Bodean]

The Monterey Cypress stands strong unpruned on the bluffs of the sea.
If your house stood behind the tree blocking the wind from the sea,
Would you prune it, of deadwood?

P.S,

Darin, The GGNRA is on a thing about trees are non native, so many of the parks trees are being cut down.
Hawk Hill is now bare for the butterfly checker spot,
the whole western bluff of Lincoln in the Presidio has been clear cut for Lessingia recovery.

Just wondering if those trees are still there.

 

[Old Monkey]

Are any of the trees natives? The ones I remember pruning most distinctively were by the Church. I've got some pictures of them on my computer.

 

[Bodean]

Exactly. trees are non native plants.

Not sure I've been to the church recently.

 

[Old Monkey]

Finally on my computer. I'd love to go back and see these. I think I did them in 2003.

This was pre Big Shot and I think we spiked them. Oops.

 

[jefflovstrom@sb]

I'm assuming Ficus Macrocarpa.

They have latent buds that sprout.

Is there such a thing as ficus macrocarpa?

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Ficus microcarpa? Perhaps?