LTO, vs contractor lic

[thattreeguy]

Just curious...
Anyone know if you can contract for tree removals with just an LTO lic, or do you have to have a state contractors liscence as well ?

I'm curious 'cause i was seriously skunked by an lto, who operates in this capacity, on a municipal job of approx $40,000.00
All removals.....but he always bids as he keeps the log proceeds, and gives a nice cheap price...uses family...one employee...nice low comp rate, but no state lic just the lto..

As far as i knew Lto was to sell logs, and do contract timber work...a little clarity here would be cool...

Nice big job , i was the #2 bidder.....my dilema is that the mills are all on holiday lay offs now or soon, redwoods payin $750.00 per 1000 and i may have to store it and sell it at a later date.Which means trucking it twice.

I bid it for what its worth with the city getting the proceeds from the timber sales sent to them directly from the mill,i figured approx six loads, at 4000 ft per load.

The other outfit figures about four loads(due to breakage)...and that they would just keep the logs and do it for.....way less than me ....and i'm not willing to take that risk...a lot of metal and defects in the trees

so after gettin skunked by this guy for the last few years and this one being the largest i thought i'd seek enlightenment

Oh and i'm not bitter, i'd rather sit at home on the house, than lose $ and if i wanted to work for free, it will be for the park of my choice.

Alright ...enlighten me

Can you legally contract jobs like this with an lto or do you have to have a state contractors lic as well

 

[SkwerI]

Must be a California thing, I've never heard of an LTO and have no clue what it is. I'd suggest going to your state government website and looking it up, maybe doing a search on LTO or something. Good luck with it.

I'd also change my bidding process to where you keep the mill proceeds and deduct it from your written bid. Government people look at the number on the bottom of the page, they can't be messing with trying to figure out what mill rates will be and subtracting it from your bid. Besides, the mill check won't go back in the same account so it doesn't count on your bid.

 

[sotc]

ask the contractors board. i wouldnt think timber operators would be allowed or insured to be working around city buildings. if its a big park maybe but if theres dismantling and such i wouldnt think so. contractors board should be able to tell you over the phone

 

[CurSedVoyce]

In CA you have to do jobs for no more than $500.00 per job/client per year. After that you need a contractors license. Now if this guy found a loop hole in that an LTO is the contractors Lic. equivalent, I would have to research it. But that is the basic rule of CA as for as contractors lic.

 

[thattreeguy]

I called the board today
and they say that you require a contractors lic , to do that kind of work.
The lto is supposed to be for the timber sale....but i believe its been being used for ages as a loop hole,

i'm calling around seeking clarification on the matter with cdf.

 

[CurSedVoyce]

CDF will probably require contractors lic, but may make an exception for wood harvesting only.... Then they would have to be caught and turned in.. CDF is limited on policing resources and relies on private or contractor turn ins.

 

[thattreeguy]

Kinda like OSHA around here, they're over in redding, if you see a serious violation and call it in they ask for a pic, and thats it.

 

[sotc]

sounds like a phone call to the municipality is in order

 

[CurSedVoyce]

Almost takes a serious screw up anymore. two years ago here you could just turn them in with a pic.

 

[thattreeguy]

CDF will probably require contractors lic, but may make an exception for wood harvesting only.... Then they would have to be caught and turned in.. CDF is limited on policing resources and relies on private or contractor turn ins.

Nope...CDF says they wish that the contractors board would get it right,

and the contractors board says CDF is wrong......


so now im arrrgh... maybe its time to call...The Governator's Office and seek clarification...or more B.S.

 

[thattreeguy]

sounds like a phone call to the municipality is in order

 

[stehansen]

I was under the impression that the LTO was a license that was sometimes required in addition to the contractor's license by some government jobs. When I first started I didn't have anything and I had applied for my contractor's license but it took 9 months for that to happen and in the meantime I couldn't get WC without a contractor's license.

 

[thattreeguy]

UPDATE
We are going round and round over the award of the contract,

the city decided that because his subcontractor (the log hauler)has a contractors lic as well as an lto its ok.
I say a contract awarded to a prime contractor ...must be awarded to he who holds the contractors lic

the city says that its ok, i say bs

then the city says well your a contractor, but not an lto,
they somehow feel my being a liscenced prime and subbing the lto portion out is not right either

any ideas folks?

 

[Newfie]

Sounds like the bid was rigged.

 

[sotc]

sounds like you may not get anymore work from them if you raise to big of a stink. i agree, bid should be awarded to liscenced bidder, not possible sub

 

[thattreeguy]

sounds like you may not get anymore work from them if you raise to big of a stink. i agree, bid should be awarded to liscenced bidder, not possible sub

apparently according to the lic board they dont have jurisdiction over public works contracts, aint that a joke...its up to the municipality

so maybe ill go over and get hit by a truck...ha a new 40 acres here i come

i dont want to get black balled on do more work for them...but why bother being liscenced if the laws are so full of holes

its so lame

 

[thattreeguy]

IT GETS BETTER
The guy who got the bid, was forewarded my corespondence with the city, ...which aint right
so i...had him confront me at the gas station, ready to scrap,over the whole thing yesterday,
i guess ya almost have to have a lawyer these days to deal with all the bs.....i'm dropping the issue for the moment , but gonna keep up on what options are to be had down the road

 

[SkwerI]

Newfie was right (gawd it hurts saying that)!

Of course the expectation that any government entity is 100% legitimate and above board is foolish and unrealistic. You simply do not have the political influence to win the bid, and your bid only serves to help the chosen bidder extract more money from the contract.

 

[Newfie]

Now just lowball the shit out of the next bid and make it hurt for the cheater.

 

[thattreeguy]

my climbers say $100. cheaper than him on any bid, they want to send him down,
i m not sure if thats they level i want to play on

you cant underbid quality and i dont know how to do a half assed job

praying for nasty storms

 

[Newfie]

I wasn't suggesting that you bid it to get it. Just to squeeze his margins.

 

[thattreeguy]

I let the wcisa know about the loophole/ confusion about lic contr. vs lto
Maybe the can push for clarity and tighten up the loophole.
if not well so be it

 

[sotc]

thats more of the kind of thing tcia would do rather than wcisa

 

[thattreeguy]

thats more of the kind of thing tcia would do rather than wcisa

yeah you're right, but they had some big article that went on and on about the cslb and blah blah blah, so i threw it out to rose epperson, hoping for a ray of light she's kin to a huge municipal outfit down there in so cal.
its 530am and i'm gonna head to town and search for a days work for the crew

 

[thattreeguy]

UPDATE
the city let the work proceed, and the neighbors complained,
reporters called, we told em just a little of whats going on regarding the arborist report and that the bid went to an un liscenced contractor , the city and every one s up in arms, so now we are thrown into the spot light, for better or for worse we are pushing foreward with the crusade about hiring properly liscenced contractors, and the lto vs contractor loophole may be thrown into the spot light long enough to draw attention and have the situation resolved, maybe preventing this from occuring again.
WOW!!! i think that summed up my evening