alternatives in land use

Not just the brink.........the plane has crashed into the gawtdamn mountain!

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Damn.

Hey that brings a question to mind: You are a strong and conservative-minded thinker, and I'm just wondering- there would seem to be many environmental problems currently seeming to be critical (by some at least), like climate change, overpopulation, oceanic plastic pollution, species like sharks and rhinos becoming endangered due to exploitation and poaching, and of course desertification/deforestation.

Do any of these issues bother you a lot or do you generally think they are overblown? Not trolling, just wondering.

cory said:

.....Do any of these issues bother you .....

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Cory, really?

Not at all over blown, in my mind Cory. Good question, in fact I will be taking more questions after my presentation is finished

The reason I say that would be that some of the largest critics of Mr. Savory's work are working for our Federal govt. The USDA has published papers about how Savory is a quack, and that his methods dont work.

That right there tells me there is a problem. You fellows think that I am a climate denier, right? Not a bit. I have no doubt that man has contributed to the plight of this planet.

The problem I see is a govt that would publish papers against sustainable agriculture....while people on the ground are having success, is the same govt that is telling us we are all doomed, and need to fight climate change and environmental issues head on.

This same govt is helping big Ag outfits kill sustainable ag operations in third world countries...think Africa and South America. This same govt makes us buy curly Q light bulbs and then spreads war and destruction around the globe for profit, kills folks for oil, and overthrows other govts for profits on behalf of the banks and corporations. (Think Libya)

We broker trade deals that harm the environment, we encourage rampant consumption........Bob and I are not the leaders in this field.


The over population question is a tricky one for me. I dont believe it is worth really debating until someone gathers a group of people together and decides who lives and who dies.

I am fully prepared to feed as many people as possible, if I can increase production while helping the environmental problem, all the better. But I will not support actions that would see millions or billions die. That is no kind of solution. I am no more valuable than some loin cloth wearing dude in Africa. He just wants to provide for his family too.

Better yet, let that man if Africa use methods to feed himself and his own countrymen....sustainable. Tell Monsanto to frig off. Tell the UN that food bags are no way to survive.

If the world govts wanted to stop the pollution of our oceans with plastic, they could do it in a week, but that would be bad for profits and tough on re election campaigns.


Its much easier to wring our hands and hold Jerry Lewis type telethons than it is to make positive changes. Our leaders are not interested in making those changes, or helping make changes. We are alone.

Ha! I missed the sharks, whales and rhinos question. That too could be stopped in a week if they really wanted too.

Might piss of our trade partners though........gotta keep that plastic flowing out of China. Save money, live better and all that.

I know I have mentioned it before, but I work very closely with our local District Conservationist. He works for the Natural Resource Conservation Service......under the watchful eye of the USDA. He is an honest to god Federal Employee.

Our monthly or Bi monthly visits usually last for an hour or two. Usually he cancels his other meetings after our talks. He says his mind is too full.

I listen to him talk about how his parent agency, the USDA, disagrees with almost everything that he does, not nessicarliy directly though. The NRCS will publish a study about sustainability and the USDA will publish a study about the opposite. His agency pushes one plan and his parent agency pushes another.

It is very frustrating for him.

I see it too. The NRCS wants holistic grazing, cover crops, and diversity.....the USDA wants less stock units, fallow and mono cultures.

The banks, chemical companies, packers, insurance companies, and machinery manufacturers lobby the USDA, not the NRCS.

Ok, someone else post something!

Go Jim!

Sorry buddy, my mind is way too full.

Haha! Thanks Justin.


Sorry Dave. I do feel sorry for the NRCS man. I unload all my ideas and thoughts on him in a very short time frame....I know he is joking, but I do get on a roll sometimes.

It is a good roll though. Impressive actually.

I just listened to a clip on the Tasmania Country Hour on the radio, its our daily rural report...guess what they were talking about, no till diverse cover crops going in after the poppy harvest! They were trialling it no irrigation as well, more to see how much money they could save with putting a cover crop on in this way, like no till to save machinery costs, and no irrigation to save water costs. He did mention as well about no till being better for the soil and eventually adding value to the cash crop because of healthier soil.

Wow, I wouldn't have had a clue what the significance of this all was if I hadn't have been reading this thread, see Jim you are adding to the increase of knowledge

Ha! Great observation to pass along, Fiona. I, too, am lurking and learning with this thread. Jim, just expostulate whenever you can/like to do so. Your writing is strong...cogent, well stated, organized, easy to read.

We have land we rent out on our S. GA farm...the big boy farmer plants peanuts, cotton (mostly), sometimes soybeans. It is all a "happenstance" for me...I only get there a few times a year so don't get to see all that is done but it is done "normal" / modern school...tilled, sprayed, etc., regular hoi polloi farmer methods. We have a smaller field next to the bigger one (approx. 25 acres) and it has not been tilled in many years. Grass grows there and we keep it cut. It will be interesting one day to do soil samples on the adjacent fields to see how they compare.

You have got me wondering about strange stuff these days....

To update my little garden. I've sent out soil samples and I'm starting to lay out my fencing plan.

Now to go no-till and get some garlic in this fall it seems my option is to use a plastic or landscape type fabric and cover the areas I want my beds. Then pull them up this fall and add my mulch. Plant and weed as needed? I'm wondering if I can skip the ground cover and graze it right off with my horses? Goofy idea?

I'm off momentarily to visit another farm and see a grass overseeder in action(ha, exciting I know). Also check out some of their row crops.

What do you mean by fencing plan?

I only ask because several producers that incorporate livestock into their operations have stated that they wish they had not put in permanent fence. Focusing instead on move able electric.

I have been considering how to do it. Fencing plan is plan in general. I have a bunch of fencing I am doing regardless. If I do fence off the garden area I'm going to make it the size of the adjacent pasture that I'm fencing anyways. I also am doing perimeter fencing on my roadside as the last couple of winters the grader has taken a toll on the twig sized posts the previous owner used in spots. I think you've commented before that I like a rather stout fence, and I do.

But yes I could get away with electric I think. I have to fend off deer if I grow anything edible to them.

I should clarify too I just rent a pounder so I line up all the posts I want to do ahead of time and lay it all out. Bang it out on a Saturday to Monday rental(free day!). So that's why it's a plan for me. I need to do everything I'm doing in that two day window. I loathe renting tools but pounders are a mint even second hand around here.

Okay, I understand.

We use perimeter fence too, permanent, with electric fence used to strip it out.

What the other producers were talking about was using temporary electric instead of permanent fence for strip grazing. They figured if you were going to strip graze you should use something move able because the permanent fence would never be just where you want it.

Yah. That makes sense. It would allow me to leave it as part of my hay for now too.

I wonder if I still took the hay off it this year if I could graze it down intensively after the last cut, then top dress my beds with my nice compost and plant in garlic?

FireFighterZero said:

Our leaders are not interested in making those changes, or helping make changes. We are alone.

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Heavy statement. And true, no doubt. Good thing the "we" includes high quality stock like Big Jim.

FireFighterZero said:

Usually he cancels his other meetings after our talks. He says his mind is too full.

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Gotta love it.

DMc said:

It is a good roll though. Impressive actually.

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+1

A couple years down the road, Jimbo will be the 'Gabe Brown' that folks look to for answers

Either that or I will be working at a gas station........

No till farming is becoming more widespread.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...s-actually-a-big-deal/?utm_term=.999178d06eda

Building healthy soil, and farming myths

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/3-big-myths-about-modern-agriculture1/