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Which is one reason I don't let apprentices run 8 pin till they have proven themselves capable.

MS 441, Ms 461. But then i only run an 18" bar on those saws. Stricktly for limbing big ones and felling smaller stuff. Works wonderfully, assuming one can file really well. My apprentice used my saw last week for the first time, and got a total WTF moment about how fast it cut. We don't let...