Daly Mansion Tree ID

Underwor

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Avon, IL
While visiting with David and Sylvia last week, we got to discussing the correct ID of a tree labeled Quercus alba. Here is a picture of the leaves. I believe it to be Quercus lyrata, based on some very immature acorns that had the overcup characteristics. The leaves are close, but not exactly like any photo I have found so far. What do you think?
 

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Bob, where is this at ? looks like a Water oak to me. Quercus Nigra? MMM.... maybe not not that I looked closer
 
Ya gotta be careful with spotting specific parts of the tree which look slightly different from the rest of the tree.
Often the tree hybrid (izes?) various parts of itself and makes it confusing.
 
I dont belive it's a white oak either.

white oak
 

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Hey Bob, nice pictures, thanks for posting. The id of this tree has been driving us nuts. It is possible the original foresters at this site recognized it as A white oak and that is as far as it went.

Believe it or not, the pictures Bob posted are typical of the leaves throughout the tree. Nothing quite like I have seen before. This is a moderately large tree of approx 100 ft tall with 78 ft spread, 51" dbh. Ascending limbs, lots of fuzzy growth not dissimilar to a bur oak without the winged bark.

I think a hybrid in this case could be a distinct possibility. Here is a good picture of the bark and a so-so picture of the entire tree. We can try to get pictures from within the canopy if anyone thinks it would help. I might, at least, be able to find more mature acorns.

Dave
 

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P.S. Sylvia has noted that the Q. Lyrata is at the very edge of the zoning for our area.
 
Based on the Eastern species I'm familiar with, it's not a white oak or a water oak.

My guess is hybrid with post oak in the mix. The leaves look like stretched post oak.
 
I'm thinking it's a post oak. I would take cuttings and try to graft some new ones or save acorns. It could be a cool variety.
 
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Here is a very immature acorn that lead me to believe Q. lyrata.
 

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Great pic!

No other acorn has a cap that Cups Over the shell like that--Quercus lyrata it is!!
 
Thanks Guy and way to go, Bob, for the quick professorial analysis.

Could this be a Quercus alba/Q. lyrata cross?

It would be convenient because instead of making a whole new sign, I could put a /Q. lyrata. :D

This is the first acorn that has been found off this tree. I will be doing an aerial inspection next weekend to try to find a more mature acorn.

Dave
 
I'll get some leaves off the UNC oak next week; gives me an excuse to revisit a tree i radial-trenched/soil replaced 4 yrs ago; see how it is doing. :roll:

It's a very cool species, from the few I have seen.
 
Bumping this because I have a few more questions. Guy, did you ever get over to take a look at the Q. Lyrata in UNC?

A buddy, Cody, and I climbed our tree Saturday to see if this tree would give up any secrets. We could not come up with anything new. The acorns still have not developed much more yet. The average size of these leaves are amazing. The picture of the leaf I posted here is typical of a terminal leaf.

Also this tree has been here for over 100 years with our winters often going to -35 deg F. I linked a USDA Plants website on the Q. Lyrata's current range. I would say we are fairly well out of its comfort zone. Would be very interested if anyone else has seen one growing north of its current range and what its growth pattern is like.

This tree has overachieved its typical growth pattern. We are trying to substantiate its uniqueness in this setting.

http://www.plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=QULY

Dave
 

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